Sam Harris picks a fight with God

Great show. He makes a perfect sense!!!

Patt,

You let that smug know-it-all Sam Harris babble on and you challenged him on practically nothing!

For example, did you ever think that an atheist might not kill others for fear of going to PRISON. You didn't even mention that!

And you let this Harris guy refer to selected scripture as a jewel in the dung heap. You let that slide. You coward! What agenda are you pushing here, or do I have to even ask?

The Sam Harris interview was nothing short of pathetic. What an inept poser you are as an interviewer.

R.J. Johnson
Los Angeles

He clearly does not understand what all the major prophets have taught.

wow, a wonderful insight into the underpinnings of beliefs and how it is applied by so many. Will be reading a great deal more by this person. Gives a very positive view of how the future could be.

Could not turn off my radio even though I have a million things to do. Haven't heard Sam Harris before, but he speaks so clearly about the issue of religion. Great speaker. Fully intend on reading his books and giving them to my children. Thanks so much for having him on your show.

What's a theologist? Re: this line above line, "Harris would even argue that the future of civilization is dependent on it (i.e. questioning one'sreligious faith), thank you Mr. Harris. As a Chrsitian (so maybe I get to be a theologist), I feel very few of my pew-mates sufficiently value doubt and honest questioning. And it scares the be-Je....um...heck out of me sometimes. I hope Harris takes his views "on the road" to forums likely to include clusters of credulous types. Azusa Pacific, Biola, Pepperdine, Loyola....does he? And thanks for a good show again, Pat.

Great show. He makes a perfect sense!!! I love this guy

A secular world would be heaven onearth (if you'll excuse the pun)!
Sam Harris is htting this topic right on the head.
We as humans have an innate understanding of what is right is wrong.
I don't need a book ...written thousands of years ago ... espoused by modern day "prophets" to tell mewhat I already know is right or wrong.
Religion and Faith is a personal belief structure ... the operative word is "PERSONAL" ... what you want to believe is what you want to believe ... and vice versus for myself.

He is perfectly articulate. I wish he would tone down the anti-Bush rhetoric. The fact is, as he points out now, we still have a president who ends every darn thing he says with "God bless America" as though the God of Abraham, Joseph, or Muhammed cares about blessing the USA.

I can't respect anyone who denys religion when clearly he has not studied it or understands it at all.

This is a brilliant ...

I love reading posts like from people like Tae. They have to say the same thing twice because they didn't really believe it the first time. LOL

This is why I love to listen to KPRC - no punches pulled and everyone gets a say. Sam Harris is articulate and obviously convicted in his positions. Whether I believe what Sam Harris has to say or not I now have some new insights and info I can consider for myself. Thanks Pat!

Kate,
I sincerely don't know if you are being sarcastic, because he sounds better versed in religion than most of the fervent religious people I talk to / hear on TV and radio shows.

Mr. Harris is a materialist and sees the world in a particular way. He uses a rather dishonest strategy to disarm those who are religious by stating, essentially, that if you don't see it my way you are irrational and foolish. Thoise who have a simple and perhaps uniformed faith may be intimidated and unfortunately they often reply with hostility, but I am sorry to say that Mr. Harris, for all his reason, does not have the ultimate word on such matters. He is well, interesting, but he will ultimately do more harm than good in his quest to validate his reasoned opinions.

Excellent interview. I can't wait to read Mr. Harris' books. He is refreshiingly articulate and does a fine job of representing a reasonable and scholarly approach to life. You don't have to be a "Christian", as so many Americans believe, to be good, kind, and moral. Thank you, Pat, for the interview.

Very compelling interview! Thank you, for this because for too long this has been a taboo. Really enjoyed Sam's articulate and to the point manner. He brought up many interesting, and clearly controversial points. That doesn't mean that they don't hold up. I think some of the dissenting opinions might prove a couple of his views.

I, too am looking forward to reading his books and continuing this conversation.

Sam Harris is the true voice of reason. Too bad so many Americans are scared to admit they have serious doubts about the supernatural because they'll be ostracized or attacked.

Great show Pat. I think your guest is so great. We need more people to view and understand his ideas and where he is coming from. I think most religion is far more a source of sadness and grief in the world in contrast to the amount of happiness and satisfaction most people would tend to believe they get from religious belief. Especially organized Abrahamic religions. I come from Utah originally and I see so much hypocrisy from the predominant religion there I grew tired of it and came to California 25 years ago. It is clear from posters like R.J Johnson where relgion has gone wrong with some people.

Patt - Sam Harris is a wonderful guest. Reasonable and humane.

My comment -- and this is from your biggest fan -- is directed at YOU, Patt.

I wish you would stop hacking into the flow of your guests' delivery with "smart" comments. They are not cute, they don't show how "with it" you are -- though of course you ARE. It is just plain rude to disrupt, as I said above, the comments of an earnest guest who is working hard to strike a balanced tone. I've hard you do this over & over, and I do wish you would consider JUST LISTENING instead of constantly interrupting with one-liners!

R.J. Johnson, I suspect the fear of prison is a bigger deterrent than the fear of Hell even among Christians when it comes to committing murder. The percentage of convicted murderers in prison who are Christian is higher than their percentage in the general population, so either atheists are disproportionately smart enough to avoid getting caught or they're not really any more murderous than their Christian brethren.

Props to you, Patt. I suspect you're a believer yourself, but you were still professional and allowed the person you were interviewing to express his views. You DID challenge him on several of his statements, and even made him qualify one or two, but it's clear that he's thought things through and has covered this ground many times before. Having read a couple of his books, I'd wager that he's more familiar with the substance of the Bible and the Quran than those who are here making blanket statements branding him ignorant.

I won't live to see the day that today's major religions are given no more deference than the gods of Asgard or Mount Olympus, but if human culture survives another 10,000 years, I know that day will come.

Thank you for this show! I really enjoyed hearing the part I caught in the car . It seems like so much of our political discourse is spent on politicians trying to prove who is more Christian than the other. It almost feels like you cannot say the things that Sam Harris says aloud. I was so happy to hear it on the radio. And then I walked into Subway and the group of five next to me prayed over their sandwiches.

I found this to be one of the most meaningful interviews I've heard on NPR. (And that's saying a lot!) So much violence, anger and division has been created over the years, in the name of someone’s god…for this reason alone I detest organized religion. Perhaps with more such reasonable discussion, those of us who are, by definition, atheist, can say so openly without being treated as a pariah.

Awesome discussion!! Love the guy!!!

Thank you, thank you. I love hearing intelligent people for a change. TED interviews may be my favorites of the KPCC year.

The title should have been: Sam Harris picks a fight with religious belief

Hey Michael from Orange

My complaint was with the interviewing style of Patt Morrison, OK? It was truly weak. That was my beef. The rest is in YOUR head. I have produced documentaries for PBS, Showtime, Bravo, etc. and I know what I'm talking about here.

And Michael from Orange,

I actually find it a bit humorous when people attack someone like me for being aggressive and firm when they say cheap shot things like: “It is clear from posters like R.J Johnson where religion has gone wrong with some people.” They use the old, tired, prosaic religion is the problem slam. To me, that is so trite and condescending.

RJ - I have to agree with Michael all the way on this one.

"You let that smug know-it-all Sam Harris babble on and you challenged him on practically nothing!"

When you belittle the guest and the articulation of his point of view to demean the interviewer, you lose some credibility as a critiquer.

"For example, did you ever think that an atheist might not kill others for fear of going to PRISON. You didn't even mention that!"

She did, however, ask the opposite question about Mr. Harris' exchange with Rick Warren, when she asked about why Rick Warren wouldn't kill Sam Harris, since he does not believe in Christ and essentially would have no value in the far-right Christian's mindset.

"And you let this Harris guy refer to selected scripture as a jewel in the dung heap. You let that slide. You coward! What agenda are you pushing here, or do I have to even ask?"

If you think there are only one or two passages that hold up the contradictions that Mr. Harris pointed out, you are only deceiving yourself. Why do we always hear words like agenda and indoctrination from people who vehemently disagree with someone else? I thought Patt let him talk a lot a times without challenging him, but he was also more coherent and put together than some other guests where she has to prod them along.

"The Sam Harris interview was nothing short of pathetic. What an inept poser you are as an interviewer."

And lines like this just make the attackers sound like jealous 4 year olds.

It was so refreshing to hear someone who isn't afraid to be politically incorrect by telling the simple truth. I am sick and tired of hearing politicians base national policy on their religious beliefs. Why do we send food to starving people in third world countries? Food only increases their overpopulation! We should be sending them aide in the form of birth control. Why are so many people concerned about suppressing gay rights? Many of the people who quote Leviticus eat shrimp or readily discard other portions of the bible, focusing only on the passage that they feel justifies their homophobia.

I’ve been an atheist since I was 13 and began thinking for myself, rather than taking everything I was told by ministers and parents at face value. Sam Harris, you are my hero.

Hey jon826,

NPR is funded with tax dollars and I will speak out when someone like Morrison just let's a person talk and talk. That was NOT an interview.

I'm not here to please you and I'm not hear because of religion. My complaint is with Morrison's lack of interviewing skills. She just let's people rant...paid for by our tax dollars. I expect more.

I have produced award-winning TV programs for PBS primetime and I know what I'm talking about here. With all due respect, If you think that is childish, that's your problem. NPR should be more than just a platform for the progressive left to spew unabated.

If you think this is bad, see how long Sam Harris would last publicly talking about Allah in the Middle East.

Many of you seem clueless as to the importance of examining and being critical of today's media. I say speak out!!!!

And why am I not surprised that the atheists come out in droves to listen to NPR... LOL

I think the reason emotions run high in religious discussions such as this is because the stakes/outcomes are so high. As Dr. Harris as well as many on the other side agree. I am just perusing the subsequent discussion. Both sides use pejorative/provocative language (ie. Harris’ comments about Iron Age concepts). This type of sparring, though entertaining, does not yield substantive dialogue. As with most discussions of this type, positions are pushed to the extreme rather than seriously engaged. As a person on the ‘theologist’ side I found myself in agreement much of the time, but a little disappointed in the lack of recognition of just how much commonality exists between scientific and religious worldviews. For example, as Dr. Harris surely knows, faith/believe is not the exclusive domain of religion as the narrative of Einstein’s discovery of general relativity shows. It was years later that technology before technology was able to prove Einstein’s equations. So I agree with Dr. Harris that we are not talking about ‘two languages,’ but I just wish for more positive interaction and dialogue, precisely because the stakes are so high.

Robert - well said.

I find it funny that so many of Patt's interviews get few responses but this one gets 33. Do the atheist topic, and they come out of the woodwork.

God bless you all! :)

I love coming here and reading comments from people like RJ Johnson, who has to say twice that he's produced shows for PBS because he didn't believe it the first time. It's amusing to learn that he's not "hear [sic] for religion" while he whines that Patt (who produces 10 hours of content every week) "let's [sic] people rant."

Guess your spell checker (and your home schooling) let you down. Maybe you should produce a radio show yourself instead of trying to hitch your wagon to a star like Patt Morrison, on a forum paid for by the public.

Dr. Harris makes many clearly uninformed assumptions about the nature of religion and faith. I sincerely doubt that he has spent much time truly studying the great religions of the world. It was evidenced by his complete misunderstanding of how Christianity and Islam are related. Taking a short quotation from the Koran completely out of context is just as bad as the worst religious fanatic using a quotation as justification for murder. What Dr. Harris doesn't see - even though it is right in front of him - is how the great religions of the world are and have been saying the same thing that he understands science to be teaching us. We must love and respect one another, care for the earth and its creatures, and understand that there is a power greater than ourselves at work in the universe. This last thing helps instill in us a sense of awe and mystery at the world, which science does as well. Doesn't he see that science and religion go hand in hand? Without science, religion does become fanaticism and superstition, but without religion, science becomes purely materialistic and destructive. They are like two wings of a bird that allow us to remain balanced.

Poor ol' R.J. is an angry and bitter man. He now realizes that he's been duped after hearing Sam Harris explain the farce of religion so clearly and consisely.

Very interesting interview. I'd never heard of Sam Harris before. Thanks for putting him on.

@Kate

With all due respect, criticizing Harris' knowledge of religion then summarizing all religions in a breathtakingly sophomoric bromide [ "We must love and respect one another, care for the earth and its creatures, and understand that there is a power greater than ourselves at work in the universe." ] only serves to prove Harris' point about how many modern Christians conveniently discard the more distasteful "Iron Age" remedies - stoning, smiting, casting out, etc. - for rule-breaking of the most ridiculous of colloquial 1st century beliefs and superstitions.

Religion is more than a well-intentioned kumbaya sentiment. It has always been about controlling people - their values and behavior - well-intentioned or otherwise. It is the ultimate trump card of history's power brokers. Your criticism of Harris is not only without merit but extremely naive.

RJ -
"NPR is funded with tax dollars and I will speak out when someone like Morrison just let's a person talk and talk. That was NOT an interview."

I am merely a listener and supporter of NPR (I don't produce documentaries for PBS) and EVEN I KNOW that NPR's funding from tax dollars is minimal. It truly is our support that keeps the station on the air.

"I'm not here to please you and I'm not hear because of religion. My complaint is with Morrison's lack of interviewing skills. She just let's people rant...paid for by our tax dollars. I expect more."

Then as i wrote previously, don't belittle a guest because you disagree with the interviewer.

"I have produced award-winning TV programs for PBS primetime and I know what I'm talking about here. With all due respect, If you think that is childish, that's your problem. NPR should be more than just a platform for the progressive left to spew unabated."

I still don't just think it's childish to post your credentials as though we should all be impressed, I firmly believe it is. It's not my problem, though, just a little pet peeve.

"If you think this is bad, see how long Sam Harris would last publicly talking about Allah in the Middle East."

I don't know that he's done that, though I wouldn't put it past him. But alas, Mr. Harris has spoken within the Islamic community of the United States and he's still alive...so i guess that doesn't help prove your point about how nefarious Islam is. (if you're not here about religion, then why do you feel the need to stereotype non-Christian religions? Or do you really think every muslim at the Torrey Pines mosque wants to fly a plane into a skyscraper?)

I absolutely agree with Mr. Harris when he says (paraphrasing) that the billion followers of Islam believe in their religion as strongly as the Christians do. There are Christians who kill - recent abortion doctor murder to negro church burnings to crusades to name a few.

And, I'm not dumb enough to think interviewers are completely objective, but most of them do basic fact checking before criticizing.

And Kate
Let's play pretend for a moment...
I am in my home with my wife watching TV and a man barges through the door and puts me in a stranglehold. My wife jumps off the couch and hits him to no avail. She finally grabs his private parts and refuses to let go until the intruder relinquishes his hold on my neck.
Now, the supreme being who dictated the Bible tells me that I am allowed to lash my attacker, I believe, 40 times, but no more because then i will lose all respect for my attacker (this supreme being has a great sense of humor). Until you get to my dear wife. Should I put her on a pedestal, buy her some new lingerie, maybe a box of chocolates for saving me? No, according to the same supreme being, I have to cut off the hand of my wife so that people know of her crime. (Deuteronomy 25: 11-12)
I'm really not sure where your view of the Bible comes from.

To Weeping Jesus, et al.

- I love when posters get all fussy about spelling and such. I wave received so many e-mails from professional in many businesses littered with mistakes. Big deal! Those comments about spelling make a great smoke screen from the issues.

I mentioned very few of my credits for the sake of credibility - knowing the atheists would be out in force here. Again, big deal!

- So Harris gave speeches in the U.S. about the muslims. So what? Try that stuff in the Saudia Arabia. That was the point and you missed it.

And finally, that was no INTERVIEW. That was a platform for Sam Harris to rant and throw out a lot of unchallenged generalities. That is why I mentioned my credits - I know the difference, first hand.

I hope the spelling and grammar was better for you this time. LOL

I stirred things up on this topic! I bet its been a while since Patt got so many comments..no?

Yes, I meant to say "I have" and not "I wave." Please, Weeping Jesus, forgive me for my error. Spell check missed it and they did not teach me proof reading in home school.

Of course I forgive you, my son. It's what I do.

I have to disagree with your characterization of the interview, though. It was a great interview. We got to hear the philosophical position of Sam Harris, not the opinions of Patt Morrison. While you may favor a more confrontational style, or disagree with Mr. Harris, it wasn't your interview.

If you'd like to offer a substantive disagreement here, instead of repeating your irrelevant "credentials" or opining that Sam Harris wouldn't be free to express such opinions in a repressive theocracy, go for it.

To John and Bob,
If one truly wants to get to the root of all religions, one must look directly at the words of the prophet that brought that religion to mankind. By studying the direct teachings of these enlightened beings one can glean some of the mystery and beauty of their offerings. The problem with many religions of the past is that these beautiful teachings have been twisted and mutilated by the very human and very fallible clergy (which all too often is part of the political system) that seizes an opportunity to use them to their greedy aims. In addition, the major religions of the past are just that - designed for ages now gone by. Laws and directives given for people 5000 years ago were clearly designed for a completely different society. Therefore they do not work in today's world. The problem for many is that the word "religion" in the US at least, seems to get confused with "Christianity," which sadly has been corrupted and co-opted by those whose hunger for power and control and will stop at nothing to gain it. And to those who think that caring for one another, the earth and its creatures and having a sense of humility in this vast universe is naive - I say, try it - every day and see what happens.

First, your secular forgiveness rings a bit hollow. And you are perhaps "borrowing" the Jesus character from another radio host here in L.A.? No? Well, no matter, it's been done.

You can defend Morrison's show any way you want to. I don't care. To me, it's supposed to be, to some degree, an "interview" show. And it's supported by tax money. I disagree with her style and find it weak. She can ask questions without being "confrontational." But, in this case, she really did not do that.

No offense, but I sometimes find that people who want to dismiss the "credentials" of others often times do it because they don't have the credentials themselves. But that's not the case here, I am sure.

For the last time, it was not bragging. You can call what I said "irrelevant" if you want to. I was just backing up my credibility when it comes to interviews and the media. And you should see the stuff I left out! LOL My issue is with Pat Morrison's approach to the whole thing.

To me, this is not about doctrine and if it was, I wouldn't get into it with someone who needs to use a name like Weeping Jesus. OK?

PS Please, no matter how much you are tempted, do not use the phrase, "Get a life," I fear it is coming out of your computer any minute now. Please, don't do it! LOL

PSS Weeping Jesus. My prediction: When the day comes that you feel those lethal, terminal chest pains or the doctor gives you that grim stare and tells you your time here will be up very soon, I think you will look to the Heavens and say, “I was only kidding, OK?” Or at least the thought of doing that will cross your mind. Yes, it I think it will. Remember this moment. And good luck!

@RJ

I don't get the relevance of your "original point" (that Sam Harris couldn't voice his opinions in Saudi Arabia)? So what? Apart from supporting Harris' point on how religion shuts down any rational debate or criticism of religion, how is it a relevant criticism of his view point?

I'm guessing that for you this is evidence of Christian America's superiority? What a bunch of nonsense! Any perceived superiority has been gained despite our religious heritage. We can thank atheists like Ben Franklin and vaguely religious deists like Thomas Jefferson who were wise enough to advocate for a secular government by separating church and state.

In all your fuming, you have yet to make one substantive refutation of Harris' actual statements - you're just mad because he dared to call out the clay feet of your belief system.

RJ, I know you're not bragging, you're trolling for a gig. For the record, I have not produced a PBS show, or even posted a YouTube video, but such "credentials" are beside the point of whether or not Patt Morrison conducted a good interview.

I think all four of her interviews at the TED conference were thought provoking and entertaining, because the people chosen to speak at TED (did I miss your name on that roster?) tend to be thought provoking and entertaining. She asked questions that enabled the people she was interviewing to express the ideas that got them invited to TED in the first place. In my opinion, she did a good job.

You keep complaining that she didn't challenge Sam Harris, but aside from your observation that fear of prison may dissuade potential murderers I haven't seen much challenge to his ideas from you either. If you want those boys on Fox network to tap you for the counterpoint when they schedule Sam Harris to discuss his new book, you're going to have to stop whining and step up your game.

Weeping,

I am not trolling for a gig (LOL). I have plenty of work. And if I were, it wouldn't be on a msg. board for Patt Morrison. Now that was funny of you. And shows your level of awareness in this arena.

You are so full of insults now...the prosaic home schooling dig...now some insane reference to Fox New. Come on. Talk about stepping up your game, you know?

And no offense, but I'm not here to discuss any or all of this with you. Nope. I was stating my point to Patt Morrison and her producer. I'm done. Bye!

Take care!
R.J.

Buh bye! I won't tell the folks at Fox that you consider it insulting and insane to hint that you might want to pander from their pulpit. Keep up the good work!

PSS (Like Colombo - "One last thing...) I've already been on Fox News, CNN (Anderson Cooper), CNN Headline News and... (Oh, darn, more of that irrelevant junk again. Sorry!)

I wouldn't waste my time reading Mr. Harris's books any more than I would waste it reading those of any other crusader, including religious. The "problem" in the world is not conveniently religious, but with the heart and mind of human beings. A comprehensive review of history proves this out. I will stick with Albert Einstein's observation, "Ethical axioms are found and tested not very differently from the axioms of science. Truth is what stands the test of experience."

Roger,

And please don't forget these words from Mr. Einstein:

"In view of such harmony in the cosmos which I, with my limited human mind, am able to recognize, there are yet people who say there is no God. But what really makes me angry is that they quote me for the support of such views."

"I'm not an atheist and I don't think I can call myself a pantheist. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangements of the books, but doesn't know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God."

"I've already been on Fox News... "

And yet here you are, calling Patt Morrison "pathetic", an "inept poser" and a "coward" like a petulant three year old. Oh, wait -- did you say Fox? Never mind... Par for the course.

Fact is, RJ, for all your bluster and screeching insults, you wouldn't last five minutes in a debate with Sam Harris. Your whiny rudeness toward a superior interviewer because she didn't ask the questions you think would have nailed him (and I doubt they would have) just makes it more obvious why she has a daily audience of thousands and you don't.

And don't forget these Einstein quotes either:

"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings."

"I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after our own -- a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty. Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body, although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous egotisms."

"I do not believe in immortality of the individual, and I consider ethics to be an exclusively human concern with no superhuman authority behind it."

Hmm, looks like they disagree on the existence of Spinoza's God, but on the subject of ethics being a product of humanity rather than a set of marching orders from a book of iron age myths it seems that Einstein agrees with Harris.

Weeping,

Hey, I was on CNN, too! That's so typical of a discussion with folks like you...they can be oh so selective in what they bring up. :)

And that audience of "thousands" phrase was pretty funny. Dude, even if it's true (and how would you know the numbers?) that's just not a lot of people for afternoon L.A radio. And Patt does not have to compete in the real world of radio where ratings count and you have to sell ads to stay on the air. ....like Air Ameriica. Oh, they went bankrupt. Ooops.

And if all you've got is that tired old prosaic Fox News slam, please...it's so lame.

But you are kind of fun. I get a kick out reading your massive (and erroneous) assumptions about me. LOL Thanks for the entertainment. Now go watch reruns of Keith Olbermann, OK? (now I'm sounding as bad as you)

Weeping,

So, according to you, Sam Harris does believe in God? No wait. He doesn't. But he and Einstein agree on part of it. Some of it? Hallf of it? But not the other part. Selectivity in agreement or disagreement? So one believes in a God and the other doesn't but they both believe in the same ethics paradigm?

You must've burned out your Google on that deal, grasshoppah. :)

Bob, you state that you can only "guess" at what I believe in and then you call it "nonsense." Now that's just intellectually goofy. Bye!

RJ, you finally got it. Einstein believed in Spinoza's god, but thought the Bible was a silly book of fairy tales. Harris believes in no god, and thinks the Bible is a heap of dung with some jewels in it.

Both Einstein and Harris have stated that they believe ethics come from human beings thinking about and trying to do the right things, rather than being a set of laws governing behavior handed down from a supernatural authority. Einstein would certainly not have said he opposed gay marriage because his god frowned on the practice.

I have no quarrel with those who believe in Spinoza's god. Those who claim that the Bible or the Quran is "inerrant", on the other hand, and attempt to shoehorn public policy into their constricted understanding of those texts --- well, I tend to disagree with them.

Weeping,

Welll, it looks like you will be able to make a good case for your beliefs when you die and have to make an accounting, grasshoppah!

LOL I couldn't resist!

There is a moment of truth down the road that you will have to face. It will be interesting to see how strongly you cling to your personal amalgam of dogma then...? Hmmm....

I've faced death a couple of times in my life. One time the threat came and went so fast that I didn't have time to reflect, but one time I was going under the knife with the understanding that I might not wake up afterward. I didn't waver in my beliefs, or say a silent prayer "just in case", so I'm pretty sure there's no "I was only kidding" in my future.

I don't really care if you think you're going to live forever in the good place, and sing hymn after hymn praising the almighty (wait, is that the GOOD place?). I believe this life is all I have, but it's more than enough.

Then you shall forever be my little "grasshoppah."

:)

R.J.

PS "Pretty sure" - I love the implied wiggle room!

Weeping,

Here is my question of the day and I am not set on the answer: If few people really listen to what you have to say and no one pays you for your ideas (like selling books, etc.), then how credible and true are your opinions, really?

Weeping,

And just because a person is good at rhyming the words, it doesn't mean they are a poet.

R.J.

I returned home not long ago from one of my many sojourns to missions with a huge amount of donations in tow for impoverished Native Americans in Northern Arizona. Having read these comments as I unwind and catch up with other business, I must say that as a practicing Christian from the time that I know what Christianity was, I am appalled at the comments of R.J. Johnson. He gives some Christians a bad name via his attitude and demeanor.

Christians should act like Jesus and demonstrate the love, compassion and tolerance that he showed to us which is my compass. In doing so, I have no ill will toward Dr. Harris, nor other athesists. They are partners in this life for doing good in the world for others. Such is a secular and non-secular ideal. My God is one of love, compassion and mercy. We will all be judged by how we treated others, not by how many excerpts of Scripture we can cite, nor by our words. Actions speak volumes.

I am looking forward to an upcoming debate that my family, friends and I will be attending on the subject of faith in which Dr. Harris will be participating. I listen to KPCC and to all of their guests for the enrichment and thought-provoking discussion that flows from good interviews conducted by Ms. Morrison. Each journalist and/or news anchor has their own style. Hers is very glib and engaging. When I have time, I will listen to her interview with Dr. Harris and I am sure that I will benefit from it in some way, both spiritually and intellectually.

For my fellow Christians, who love to criticize me and my fellow Progressive Christians, I offer some advice that I have gleaned from my life's work in volunteer and professional ministry: I leave the judging to God. I am way too busy trying to do what God has called us to do, which is to make the lives of others happier. This is what all people of all faiths who believe in a supreme being are called to do. Let's all judge less and love more. This means that we stop condemning immigrants, homosexuals, people of ethnicities different from our own etc. Please try it sometime. You will like yourself more, and you can keep trying to make a positive difference in the world despite the obstacles and the suffering therein. Go forth!

This show plucked at the strings of my heart.
I hope that this message will touch others too.
Wake from the dream and start living as Eckhart
Tolle might say :)

Sue from Yorba Linda,

You say you leave the judging to God, yet you judge me. Yes you do.

My complaint was with Patt Morrison as an interviewer. OK? She let Sam Harris rant and say that the few Bible scriptures he happens to like "were jewels in a dung heap." And for Patt to not even address that for a moment is terrible journalism (especially on a tax supported public radio program!) That was my issue here. This, to me, is about journalism and not religion.

But on a religious note, you seem to forget that when Jesus became angry at the money changers, he got very aggressive. Remember that? He could get upset and be very critical. Remember the Pharisees?

So, please go forth and keep this in mind as you are so critical of others.

With love...

R.J. Johnson

RJ -

I have formed a very clear image of you after having read ALL your posts.

Dirty T-shirt barely covering a pot belly, yellowed boxers around your knees, sitting on the can with a lap top pecking away with two fingers lashing out. Don't you just love how WIFI signals will reach every room in the house.

Get out of the house, off the computer, take a walk. I am sure you can then have a more fulfilling conversation with your imaginary, invisible adult friend.

Religious Faith = Troglodytes

Mestengo,,

Mistako.

:)

R.J.

PS Mestengo, I resent that so much! My T-shirts are very clean, thank you!

R.J.

"Kate
2 days, 17 hours ago
I can't respect anyone who denys religion when clearly he has not studied it or understands it at all."

I can't respect anyone who holds strong opinions on subject matters she knows nothing about. Sam has studied religions for decades.
I also have trouble respecting people who can't spell 'denies'.

Bad Rabbit,

Well, if you're going to get all fussy here, I believe the correct punctuation is, "denies."

Oh, ye, without quotation mark sin, cast the first....

Sam Harris gets to go on with out a counter balance. However, when a person with a pro-religon point of view is promoting his book, Michael Schurmer, gets to "balance" him off. Schumer of course gets to go on the air without the counter weight.

These antidiest always quote Torah portions from their view point with ZERO knowledge of Jewish tradtion and interrupitation. They really no nothing about the subject, but are allowed to come on as "experts."

Bruce,

Amen.

R.J.

I love Sam Harris...Sam for President!

Sam Harris, by makling it his "Life's mission" to "Force the faithful to question their religious faith", without expressing an understanding of the purpose/need that religions have played in the past to benefit mankind and to offer no alternatives to this purpose/need, is barking up the wrong tree and is preaching only to the choir. I humbly suggest that Harris apply introspection into this matter and give equal thought to all factors and conditions that exist today.

I'm surprised by the sheer number of people who hadn't heard SH before and am glad you'd been educated by him. Now go out there and spread the word.

I AM GOD

The word is "theologian", not "theologist".

Great interview.
Sam Harris continues to be a rational voice at a time of increasing religious dogma.

Hurray for Sam Harris! He is hardly bitter or smug or anything else brain-dead religionists call him. He is a great man.

Is Sam standing next to a Christmas tree? That cheeky bastard. Sam is so adept at dismantling religion, it is a true pleasure to listen.

I haven't heard the interview. But what I think is telling about all these comments is how diametrically opposed, and absolutely immovable, people in both camps are. There is no middle ground. You can't "kind of" believe in God, and once you've taken a position, any concession to the other side looks like a full-scale capitulation.

So we dig in. We stick to our convictions inflexibly. This is how the civil war began.

Before I ever heard of Sam Harris I was well on my way to being a non-believer. I just simply didn't buy into it, but went along with the whole charade. I was brought up a Catholic, and just came to the conclusion that it was just to much unexplained nonsense. The trinity, the host, the infallability of the Catholic Church etc. It goes on and on.
I think that Sam speaks for those of us who can't put into words what we are thinking in precise terms. I find it frightening that those who's entire lives are lead by a 'book' written with such ignorance is beyond me.
I have no idea how all of this is going to turn out but I keep my fingers crossed that science and reasoning will prevail.

R.J. --

You're the atheist, buddy! Because you don't believe in Zeus! Your J.C. is small-time. Sure, he can walk on water. But can he hurl lightning bolts? No! And he's been around a lot longer than J.C. J.C.'s just a kid. Zeus is an elder-statesman!

So when the time 'o reckoning comes, when you're at death's door...I'll bet you give up your atheism...and worship the true deity: Zeus! Cuz if not, you'll be spinning in Hades while I'm partying with the Gods...on Mt. Olympus.

dennis--what makes you think that Sam doesn't perfectly understand the "purpose/need" of religious belief/faith? As for offering alternatives to it, you clearly haven't read any of Harris' books, all of which offer the best alternative of all: reason.

Sam Harris speaks for so many of us! I love it when arguments are so bright and reasonable. Thank you, Sam!!

Christians go to heaven after a lifetime of practicing their faith?
Gandhi went to hell for NOT practicing Christianity?

This is all that your God asks of you?

Love your work Sam !!

I have read most of Sam's work, and I've listened with great interest to almost every interview or debate he has participated in. The guy is absolutely the most impressive and articulate defender of Reason that I've come across. If I believed in such a thing as 'required reading' I would hope that his books would be included in such a list. He is not hateful of the concept of transcendent living or thought. He understands the good things that are included in the scriptures of many religions. But as a scientist and philosopher, I think he simply cannot tolerate the inept, illogical ramblings of people who aren't inteligent enough (or HONEST enough) to understand the implications of their dogma. Sam is a true hero, and his work should be championed by anyone who wants to see this world move forward in a 'conversational' way.

Create Cognitive Dissonance!

I think Sam Harris is great! Obviously, I agree with his viewpoint. If one goes back, far enough, in time, one will come to a point where Gods were given the credit or the blame for virtually everything that occured. As time has passed, those mystical, spiritual explanations have been discarded and replaced by natural or rational ones. The opposite does not seem to have occured. Rational explanations are not being replaced by mystical ones. Does anyone see a trend here?

R.J. Johnson drives home one of my pet peeves when trying to debate with theists. When they run out of meaningful things to say they always resort to a banal fear appeal:

"My prediction: When the day comes that you feel those lethal, terminal chest pains or the doctor gives you that grim stare and tells you your time here will be up very soon, I think you will look to the Heavens and say, “I was only kidding, OK?” Or at least the thought of doing that will cross your mind. Yes, it I think it will. Remember this moment. And good luck!"

"Welll, it looks like you will be able to make a good case for your beliefs when you die and have to make an accounting, grasshoppah!"

This is also amusing:

"PS "Pretty sure" - I love the implied wiggle room!"

I know I do. Honest people don't claim to be certain about things that they can't possibly know.

Calling people "grasshoppah" over and over is also amusing. Not only do you appear condescending but you're clearly trying to assert that you speak from some position of wisdom when you're really just an annoying troll.

92% of Americans are believers? Small wonder that the USA has so many problems especially its involvement in wars. Throughout time faith and belief has made men do some very wicked things and that is as relevant today as it was in the times when people were burnt at the stake or tried as witches. You don't need God to be good - far from it and this is what Sam Harris says. I have become a Humanist in later life and have felt great relief that all the superstitious baloney that I was taught as a child and indeed believed as an adult has been superceded by commonsense and scientific ,sound debate. I believe in "life before death" and therefore try hard to get it right on this earth.

Read everything he wrote and highly respect the man but, soo.... why does Sam Harris have a Christmas tree?

Mr. Johnson (may I call you R.J.?) - Methinks the lady doth protest too much.

@R.J. and others

If you think prison is the deterrent for the non-believer to kill others, you should look at prison population studies. Federal numbers indicate that Abrahamic religions are represented on par with their numbers in society as a whole, while atheists are GROSSLY underrepresented in prison populations...by orders of magnitude. If imprisonment is any measure of morality, then non-believers are some of the most moral people out there.

I have always liked Harris. I read his books a few years ago. He made sense then; he still makes sense.

He is articulate, well read and ,I am sorry for those who don't understand just how much Harris knows about religion, compassionate in a way that none of the religites commenting here appear to be.

The one thing Harris isn't, is angry and hostile to religites. It's a refreshing change from the anger and hostility that emanates from religites commenting on these sorts of interviews with atheists like Harris.

He is that wonderful type of person - a questioning, seeking and finding person who is interested in a truth that requires not faith but evidence. I applaud Harris and people like him. I hope he inspires others to question as well as he has and still does.

@RJ

"Here is my question of the day and I am not set on the answer: If few people really listen to what you have to say and no one pays you for your ideas (like selling books, etc.), then how credible and true are your opinions, really?"

I see you have a grand total of eighteen followers on Twitter. I think they would be the best ones to ask your question to.

It is always fun to see those with closed minds like R J Johnson try to pick fights with everyone on everything.

I wish to elaborate on what someone above me said: "I don't need to read an [old] book, to know right from wrong." In my opinion only someone who thinks for themselves is even capable of knowing right from wrong.

Religious people are more-or-less like zombies. They apply the book's formula without really thinking about it. If the formula happnes to apply correctly to a particular situation, then they do the right thing, and people say, "See, without religion no one would behave morally. But, more-often-than-not, the formula is wrongly applied or in many cases the formula itself is downright evil. Then people overlook the evil and say, "What a fine religious person."

The atheist, in contrast, must search and struggle to find the truth in any moral question. They must apply their reason. It's OK to use old books and stories to jumpstart this *reasoning* process in children, BUT absolutely wrong to train childeren to become zombies. The atheist has the best chance to evolve as their understanding and compassion grows from the struggle to tell right from wrong. The only time a religious person evolves is when they move away from, *ugh*, faith and begin to think for themselves.

@ R.J.: Amen to what? Terrible spelling and an even worse argument?

You've been whining about how this isn't an interview, but who should your audience trust: you, or a dictionary?

_interview [in-ter-vyoo]
–noun
1. a formal meeting in which one or more persons question, consult, or evaluate another person: a job interview.
2. a meeting or conversation in which a writer or reporter asks questions of one or more persons from whom material is sought for a newspaper story, television broadcast, etc.
3. the report of such a conversation or meeting.
(Random House Dictionary)

Hmm.. Let's see here...

Definition #1 [ x ]
Definition #2 [ x ]
Definition #3 [ x ]

Have you notified lexicologists of their grave error?

Oh, but how silly of me. What you really mean is that this interviewer didn't say the things that you're itching to say to Sam Harris. The things which would just stop him right in his tracks. Really profound truths like "The reason we have prisons is to keep atheists from going around murdering everyone!" Because, of course, that is so undeniably true, not a ridiculous fallacy at all. While God-less heathens would be going around rampaging, the God-fearing masses would be peacefully reading their holy books. I mean, when was the last time you heard of a theist murdering someone? I think it's safe to say it never happens. When seemingly atrocious, murderous acts are carried out by true believers, one only needs to look a little closer to find that such acts are not murder, no, but rather divinely-guided purification.

You don't need to be an expert to point out the difference between reality and imagination.

: ) I love Sam. He runs on logic and science. He makes sense! Either you're a rationalist or you're not. Religious people are throwing away rational for made up ideas - like living forever in magical heaven! .. childish

Yo Jan,

I love this whole trend where people are judged by the number of followers they have on Twitter. It's funny. I actually block most of them. I don't need that kind of thing. LOL If you want to check me out, Google me, OK? And thanks for the laugh.

R.J.

PS And I love dedicated Patt Morrison's crowd is to spelling and grammar!

R. J. Johnson

I've just looked up the definition of interview and found the following: "A conversation in which facts or opinions are sought."

Despite all your assertions to the contrary, what I have just listened to fits this description perfectly. The questions that Patt asked allowed us to gain an understanding of Sam Harris' views on a wide range of topics related to religion. There is no shortage of radio and television programs espousing views that are vociferously in opposition to those expressed by Sam Harris and it made a change being able to hear a proponent of this minority view express himself without constantly being talked over or shouted at.

Brilliant!! And, he's so damn cute I could squeeze him!

The title, "Sam Harris picks a fight with God" is so unfair and bias. He is a soft-spoken, intelligent, and very polite man. The title effectively turns many listeners off and places an inaccurate spin on not only his personality, but his message. Shame in you.

It was a pleasure listening to clearly articulated and rational arguments against religions. As Dr. Harris has convincingly demonstrated there is no need for god to be good. Religions served their purpose in the past to alleviate fear and anxiety of ignorant people when naturally occurring phenomena had not scientific explanations. Religions have also deftly exploited the fear of death and offered various forms of consolation in exchange for blind faith and obedience. I believe it is Socrates who said something to the effect that "unexamined life is not worth living". To paraphrase - unexamined faith is not worth having.

Many of the theists who left posts here did not respond to Sam's arguments. They just attacked him personally. Those attacks don't count as rebuttal. The theists here seem not to be aware of that. Either that, or they just don't care.

This one: "I can't respect anyone who denys [sic] religion when clearly he has not studied it or understands it at all".

No good. Sam has studied religion extensively and has demonstrated that fact repeatedly in his writings and his interviews. The accusation that he "clearly he has not studied it" is false. Indeed, the accuser presents no evidence to support her charges. She just levels charges and expects everyone to go along because she's upset. No thinking person can take her charges seriously then.

And this one: "He clearly does not understand what all the major prophets have taught". Sam has addressed this, too, and through his examination of the evidence has shown that the so-called prophets made all kinds of predictions that turned out to be erroneous.

Sam is fact-based and evidence-driven. But, the theists here ignore that and just attack him personally. They can't really do anything else because his arguments are too good.

This is the worst one: "For example, did you ever think that an atheist might not kill others for fear of going to PRISON. You didn't even mention that!:

Some atheists would. So what? Sam never said all atheists are good people. What he is saying is that atheism itself isn't the cause of their badness. And as the numbers show, murders in prison professing to be Christians outnumber atheist murders by a large margin. I am an atheist and I have no desire to murder. And it is not because of anything in the bible. It is because reciprocal altruism is advantageous to humans. It feels good to be good to others, especially when they appreciate it.

The theists here who have attacked Sam as person are full sound and fury signifying .... you know the rest.

I agrees with Sam Harris he clearly said it right
Sam keep up the good work i love you

Unfortunately I missed the interview but will go over the transcript when posted. RJ, please give some of the questions you would have posed to Mr. Harris. Thanks.

Bob,

My beef is with Patt. You just want to interject yourself into it, I guess.

"God,"

You forgot Definition #4.

"you, or a dictionary?" Why the comma? It's always humorous to see someone on one of these blogs being so critical of others in terms of punctuation and they make all kinds of mistakes in their own writing. LOL

R.J.

ive listened to all of sam's interviews and read End of Faith (havent read Letter to a Christian Nation), but i have to say, more interesting than the interview itself were the comments by individuals such as kate and rj. i hate to pinpoint u guys out, but ur tones are just completely condescending. kate, u for one are asserting that sam has no knowledge of religions. i invite u to read his books and listen to his other interviews. rj, first off, credentials dont determine whether u have a valid opinion or not. i can care less what ur credentials are, but reading ur posts, u emit a vibe that comes across to me as arrogant and ignorant. throwing ur credentials around and trying to be humorous with the occasional "LOL" does not help ur position. i invite u to rethink ur position and lose the aggressive attitude, because it does not help ur cause.

Message to Kate. Try reading Sam Harris's books and you will understand that his knowledge is impressive and you are dismissing his insight with your unwillingness to interpret facts - or perhaps just failing to listen. The evidence for evolution alone should be enough for you to seek out the truth. There is no authenticated evidence for religion. I'm sure you mean well - try to liberate your mind from religious dogma.

Great to see Sam back in print again. We know he has been busy but now with the Dr. in front of his name perhaps we can see more. Dr. Harris is the biggest and brightest of the 'Candles in the (immense) dark.' Go Sam. Don't let the b..r' get you down. Thank You Thank you

Oh for pity's sake- stop being pedantic about the spelling and punctuation. It is tedious!
Perhaps, you could actually focus on the interview, RJ, and provide some interesting insights regarding the discussed topics. Lets not get sidetracked by silly arguments unrelated to the interview.

RJ, Sam doesnt say anything untrue, so why expect them to "call him on it"

In my humble opinion, the blog-comment world seems to have opened up a niche where some people suddenly become experts on any given topic when they really don’t have much first-hand knowledge to back it up. It reminds me of the guy who gets carried away with his skills at playing weekend softball and he starts thinking, “Yeah, I could play for the Dodgers.”

I don’t know much but I know a bit about the interview process. I have supervised enough interviews that have been televised nationally on outlets like PBS, Showtime, Bravo, NBC( synd.) etc., to speak with a modicum of authority. And I know about the media scrutiny (like the New York Times reviewers) that comes with the airing of those interviews.

My beef is with Patt.

You know, a few of you might be obsessing on me in a small way and I find that to be just a tiny bit creepy.

R.J.

Jake,

No offense intended, but I find that most people who seemingly put down others under the umbrella that they don't care about another person's accomplishments or credentials is because they often lack them in their own world. It's a smoke screen used by more than a few.

If you say you don't care, why bring it up? Are you possibly trying to level the playing field?

PS I don't have a cause. I have a beef with Pat Morrison and her journalism skills...on a tax-supported radio station.

It's always a treat to hear Sam Harris think.

If you haven't read his books yet read them soon. Most excellent!

Thank you.

Sam Harris has never referred to himself as an Atheist. He says that's a little like saying your a non astrologist. He makes perfect sense and it's very difficult to challenge him...How many PHDs are responding to this little blog?

Always a pleasure to listen to Sam. And his arguments fit like the stones in an Inca wall. You can't get a razor blade between them.

Elena,

I did not post here to have some kind of debate about Sam Harris. I posted to get a message to Patt Morrison. That's all.

But I must add, the bit about being judged by quantity of your Twitter followers was really amusing!

In our WAKING GOD TRILOGY, we say that "it is not about saving humanity and it never has been." Ignorance is truly the root of all evil and clearly, religions seek to keep people ignorant through dogma that divides and not unites. I do believe that there is a middle ground between religion and spirituality (not dogma) and wrote about this in one of my blogs at wakinggod1.blogspot.com. Reason is not the total answer as it is based upon what we observe, which is such a small part of the Universe. Reasoning is based upon the influences upon our lives and a reasoning person in an Islamic culture is different from a reasoning person in a Christian culture-an argument to put religion aside. But reasoning quantum physicists have shown the oneness and unity of all existence that defy a reasoning/logical mindset. Yes, religion does indeed turn our minds into mush and in WAKING GOD we show the inevitable result of religion left unchecked. While there is probably no compromise between an atheist and a born again, reason will tell you that there are other ways to look at the Universe that is void of dogma and some tyrannical, vindictive deity and the belief that reason is the only way to the truth about life.

The really funny thing? The topic here seems to be ME almost as much as it is SAM HARRIS.

Such attention. Interesting.

Now for my commercial break: Please rent "It's Black Entertainment" from Netflix or Blockbuster online. It's a good special that aired on Showtime about great moments in film history. It was their Black History Month special. Thank you.

I found the link and listened to the interview. I think the weakness of Harris' position is that he doesn't accept that many people would be worse off without a religious social fabric to organize their lives and guide their actions. He claims that he can add up the good and bad things that arise from the existence of organized religion and he comes up with an overwhelming negative to positive ratio so he wants organized religion to disappear. Perhaps Patt could have been more aggressive with questions like, "Could you make a similar case that heavy metal and/or rap also should disappear?", Haven't atheistic philosophies like Communism and Eugenics also caused harm?", etc..

Bob,

"It's always a treat to hear Sam Harris think."

How do you hear Sam Harris think? Is that like a psychic thing? Just asking.

Ricky,

Don't lose that number.

-------------------RELIGION IS ORGANIZED CRIME!
-
All literate people know Muslims KILL their children
-
by tying EXPLOSIVES to their bodies and 'forcing'
-
them to KILL themselves (FILICIDE!)(MURDER!) while
-
also KILLING "Infidels", (MORE MURDER!)
-
This is ordered by the 'Musliim' RELIGION's KORAN's
-
"FIVE PILLARS OF ISLAM"! "ISLAM is well "ORGANIZED"!
-
--------------RELIGION IS ORGANIZED CRIME!
-
"Christianity" corrupts the minds of innocent
-
children and fools by 'indoctrination' with fairytale
-
LIES about a "GHOSTLY-APPARITION" "CREATOR" who
-
supposedly "Created the World" in 7 days" 6,000 years
-
ago" when in FACT the "world" (EARTH) is Billions of
-
years old!

--------------RELIGION IS ORGANIZED CRIME!

Everything is better without religion. Harris is a brilliant, intelligent human being. Religion is all fiction. NOT ONE bit of truth or proof. One day the world will see peace, and that is when religion is finally laid to rest! Until then, I am waiting for the world to change.

I knew there was no such thing as a god when I was eleven years old; and I use to tell the other kids if there was a god up there why doesn't the creep strike me down because I don't believe your up there. The other kids whould say; oh no . . . you better not say that!
Now I am seventy one years old and have read many informative books that agree with my believe. All but one of my freinds believe in god, and it is very discouraging to me that there are so many naive people in this world.

John,

You are a Thornley in their sides.

It's hogwash to think that people need religion and dogma to be good or compassionate. The End (of Religion) is Coming... It is written... somewhere... I think...

I was raised a fundamentalist protestant. I attended a bible church, where the sermons were close readings and explication. I memorized large numbers of King James translation (Shakespeare's language) bible verses in order to go to summer camp free. I sang conventional hymns and learned to harmonize. All of this fostered my literacy and love of music. I'm grateful. Then I went to college in a dusty West Texas town and as a history major took a year-long course in Greek and Roman history and culture. Hallelujah!

Sam Harris and many other informed, wise atheists proclaim my world view, though I never need to reaffirm it, and I would never think of proselytizing explicitly. I have nearly always done unto others as I wish them to do unto me. My conscience is clear nearly every day. Though my outlook is universal, I'm partial to my wife, children, grandchildren, former students, and many former colleagues.

Walking my neighborhood and traveling the wider world give me great pleasure. There's so much to read and so much music to play and hear. Life seems complete.

An aging secular humanist

.

Sam is right and its so very sad because ........God beliefs will be the downfall of civilization...............those people have one foot in reality and one in fantasy......and they like it that way so as to avoid all responsibilities for their actions by switching sides whenever convenience, ego and fear moves them...............

Sam Harris is a man of reason. Therefore, it follows that his views conflict with religion. Religion, by definition, is not about reason, fact, nor logic. Those who argue in favor of relgion, do so without fact. It is a pointless argument. Religious apologists need only respond with, "I believe." End of discussion.

The "Christmas" tree in the photo with Sam is an evergreen, affectionately dubbed a "Christmas Tree" by social practice, not by Christian basis. In truth, the tree has absolutely nothing to do with Christianity, and everything to do with secular holiday tradition, that took on a life of its own, apart from religion.

We get all huffy about those who say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas," while we make Christmas about holiday lights, buying presents, Disney yard decorations, and yes, Christmas trees - holiday activities, not Christian activities. This is not Christianity. It is secularism with only the thinnest of connections to Christianity.

What we celebrate as Christmas in the US is a "bastardized" religious practice that only remotely resembles New Testament teaching. If we truly practiced New Testament Christianity, which is more the philosophy of Saul of Tarsus than of Jesus Christ, it would be somewhat indiscernible from fundamentalist Islam.

In our ramblings about athiesm vs Christianity, we miss the point entirely that none of us can prove nor disprove the existence of God. We can "believe," or not, based on what we choose. It becomes problematic only when we claim as fact, that which is merely belief, and simultaneously attempt to dominate and control others with that belief, using it as fact.

In any rational society, reason rules, not belief. In any logical discussion the continuity of reason prevails over the inconsistency of "belief." Beliefs come and go based upon cultural whim, group-think, and hope, among other things. Reason is the result of logical consistency applied to factual information. The most significant thing about religion is that it is based on "belief," not reason, and is thereby "unprovable" as well as "undefeatable" in any discussion. Reason follows rules of logic. Religion, disavows logic in favor of, well, belief!

Some will chose belief over reason. It is a wonderful concept in any free society that this choice is allowed. The problem with religious society is that it endeavors to rob all society of the choice - to believe or not. Our forefathers not only saw fit to provide our citizenry with freedom of religion, but freedom "from" religion. Unfortunately, religion, in its eagerness to promote "belief," ignores the reason for this precedent.

Perhaps when Islam, the fastest growing religion on the planet, becomes the predominant religion in the US, Christians will understand the importance of "separation of church and state."

I want to thank all of you for clearing up this whole issue.

R.J.

Out of the gate, Sam would take me to task for my beliefs - but I have to say that his arguments are always so well founded. I wish deists could understand that his questioning them is not an attack. After all. US Christians want to have that right to question Islam and Muslims usually view such questioning as an attack. So all that is totally subjective.

Having said that, I do not believe in a god, so I am an atheist. I do, however, believe that all life (here) was created by extraterrestrials and referred to in the Bible, Bagvad Ghita, vedas, Popul Vuh etc. Sam would likely disagree with my interpretation of ancient manuscripts which he thinks are total bunk.

The important thing is that he is right. We ALL pay a heavy, heavy price for not allowing fierce questioning of ALL beliefs.

Religion is cultural. If you were born in India, you would likely be defending Hinduism. If born in Israel, defending Judaism. Defending Buddhism if born in Viet Nam. But the American will defend Christianity. And this ethnocentrism is precisely the trap as WELL as the problem with monotheism. Heck, the very IDEA of monotheism dictates intolerance since there can be only one truth. There certainly IS only 1 truth, only 1 reality. But none of us deal with reality. Even Sam. The difference is that Sam understands that he does not know what's real. (nor do I of course!!) The most dangerous people an the planet are those who ARE sure of what reality is. Not only is that blatantly arrogant, it is hopelessly primitive. And in order to not be a primitive, we need to stop thinking like primitives. We had the right to think like primitives - until we started explaining away one thing after another in the Bible and these other ancient beliefs. We no longer have that right - unless we want to remain primitives. And don't forget - Christians like to argue that against Islam - that Muslims WANT to live in the 7th century. Physician, heal thyself... :-)

Tanks San Harris.

If religions were taught as literature (beside Greek Tragedy and Shakespeare, where it belongs) we could still parse its lessons without the voodoo and the petulant power struggles. To claim something sacred is purely political.

Great show. Sam Harris is the best.

RJ, you may think you know a thing or two about good interview technique, but what you expect from Patt gives the lie to this. This was a good interview - one that allowed Harris to put his views forward clearly and fully. If you think a weak question like, "did you ever think that an atheist might not kill others for fear of going to PRISON." would have been any kind of challenge to Harris, you're deluding yourself.

I'm glad several people have commented here that they've never heard of Harris before and want to find out more. I don't agree with everything he says, but I always find him eloquent and thought-provoking. I urge anyone to pick up a copy of 'The End of Faith'. No doubt his new book will make interesting reading also.

Louis14,

No, I DO know a thing or two about interviews. Not much else. But interviews, yes.

Again, I don't care about some debate that deals with you and Sam Harris. My complaint is with Patt Morrison.

"Mauro Paz, Tanks San Harris."

What the what?

"I think the weakness of Harris' position is that he doesn't accept that many people would be worse off without a religious social fabric to organize their lives and guide their actions."

That may be, but of course that's no argument in favor of retaining religion. Sam is critical of religion because it is so often antagonistic to reason, resisting the good that reason may find--for no good reason, asking believers to make sacrifices based on nothing.

"Could you make a similar case that heavy metal and/or rap also should disappear?", Haven't atheistic philosophies like Communism and Eugenics also caused harm?", etc.. Anything can cause harm. Again, I don't think that's the issue. The fundamentalist mindset is always a threat and it is at home in the three great monotheisms. One may be fundamentalistic about anything. Political fundamentalists hurt the body politic; economic fundamentalism nearly bankrupted the U.S. Whenever some people refuse to tolerate a good old reasoned argument--even when it's in their interest to do so--fundamentalism and ignorance invariably are at work.

Great to hear Sam again .........Very clear to understand.

I greet the sun every day, Iike cosmic Carl Sagan mentioned in this song.

http://www.skeptic.com/junior_skeptic/mixtape2009/downloads/Dr_SETI_Cosmic_Carl.mp3

The way to stop a troll like R.J. is to quit interacting with him. He loves to hear his own voice. Just quit engaging his inanities and he will eventually go away. Of course, by writing this I'm indirectly engaging him. But rest assured I will not look at this comment thread again so any response of his will fly unheard into the meaningless, godless void of the universe.

R.L. Johnson...
Atheists don't kill each other as it's the wrong thing to do.
You idiot...

where can one find the text of the interview? Would like to read it....

One day I starting thinking about a continuum of belief with unicorns on the left and my elbow on the right. I starting placing my religious teachings along that scale. If something was less convincing that my elbow I dropped it from my belief system. When I was done all I had left was my elbow and a limited appreciation of good organ music.

R.J.
I highly doubt you ever held a job let alone in media.
One can get away with all kinds of BS on the net.

America has more fundamentalist Christian fanatics than even the Taliban! has mad Islamists! In my opinion evidence, science and reason will trump superstition, faith and belief any day of the weak. Good for Sam Harris!

As an AA I am ashamed that we are so mired in myth and homosexual bigotry. Love listening to Sam make point out religious nonsense.

My family loves you Sam. Thank you.

Thanks for bringing such clear, calm and thoughtful discourse to the subject Sam. Your notion of conversational intolerance is spot on.

R.J. Johnson,

For someone who hates Patt so much, you've babbled on about her here for quite a long time now. You're *kind of* embarrassing and discrediting yourself now. If you're going to troll, do it a little bit better (more discreet, less obsessive posting).

God bless

Wonderful interview with one of my favorite voices of reason, and also one of my favorite voices of compassion.

Happy to hear about the upcoming book, The Moral Landscape, and looking forward to reading it.

Kudos to Patt, also. I appreciated her sense of humor, her intelligence, and her style.

Wood, oh you know you will come back and read this stuff!

LordOsis, So atheists have never killed people or each other? Amazing.

Leos, If I were going to make up a resume for a little NPR blog, I'd make it more impressive than producing documentary specials! Come on! Raise the bar, dude! LOL

Sloobis, I don't hate Pat. Don't put words in my mouth. I just have a complaint about her interviewing skills.

You are the 8%-ers!!! A new phrase.

@RJ "You know, a few of you might be obsessing on me in a small way and I find that to be just a tiny bit creepy."

sorry bud, the problem here is that ur an ass hole and we're trying to help u out. if u want to ignore the numerous comments about how bad ur attitude is, then go ahead; in the long run, it only hurts u.

"No offense intended, but I find that most people who seemingly put down others under the umbrella that they don't care about another person's accomplishments or credentials is because they often lack them in their own world. It's a smoke screen used by more than a few."

ur right, i dont have any credentials, im in high school. what im saying is that ur credential are irrelevant in what im trying to point out. my point is that ur method of critique is pathetic, and that me, yes a high school student, knows a better way to approach constructive criticism rather than firing on all cylinders as u have done from the get-go.

everybody go look at RJ's twitter lolol he makes fun of kevin smith and seems to want to live up ryan seacrests ass =)

man, you are too old to be behaving like this imo. i feel badly for you.

Wow, you atheists can be a surly bunch!

So, how about that Sarah Palin, eh? ROFL

lea, you still in high school? That was funny. Like a little clique thing...oooh look at his Twitter acct.

Thanks for the laugh.

lea, you are close to being a stalker!

Jake, you just don't have a lot of credibility. And vulgarity is the last refuge of the intellectually limited.

Jake, please get over yourself and go do your homework and get a good education. Thanks for your time.

Sam Harris is the perfect voice of reason. Too bad so many Americans are so scared of death and its meaning that they are willing to admit they believe in the Myths invented by humans before our species learned to reason.

It is clear from the way they live their lives that the vast majority of believers do not really believe in their Mythologies.

lea, that phrase about vulgarity being the last refuge of the intellectually limited applies to you, too. Please, for your own sake, raise the bar!

For people so convinced they know the truth, many of you are pretty easy to rile up. Come on, don't be so insecure, OK? It's embarrassing.

find me an adjective that explains u better than an "ass hole" and i will substitute that instead. as far as im concerned, vulgarity is a way to express something in the worst degree. i can call u a loser, i can call u an idiot, i can call u practically anything with negative connotation and nothing would quite come close to describing u as the term "ass hole" does. most people look at vulgarity as the choice of words for the unintelligent because people take offense to it (not saying u do, which u probably dont), but for me, it's a way of expressing myself. from ur past postings, ur credibility has gone completely down the drain. in other words, u my friend, do not live up to ur so called credentials.

Religion is the bane of mankind. Thank, um, well evolution for guys like Harris.

Albert, please be so kind as to get over yourself.

Jake,

Nice try. Lame. But a nice try.

And dude, it is a noun not an adjective. Wow. You really do need to go study some more. Please, for your sake, hit the books.

Patt Morrison,

I know you are reading these posts. I bet this is the most you've ever gotten for a topic. See the attention I bring to you!

RJ,

Out of all things to criticize, it is about something being a noun over an adjective? Really man? Come on, you can do better than insult my intelligence. To insult takes really no amount of intelligence at all, so why don't you actually say something useful other than insults. You have no refutation, no anything. You complain about Morrison being a bad interviewer when you yourself can only throw around insults. You degrade people as if you are king of the world. I guarantee I can find someone with credentials 10x better than yourself who would say Morrison did a great job.

Jake,

Your mistake was a bit silly and you are understandably embarrassed and it says a little something about you. That's all. If you want to water it down, fine. But you were busted. Now, go get that person with the 10x better credentials and get their opinion. Don't just be all talk. Please do it. You said you guaranteed it. Be a person who stands behind what they say!

I have"....no anything?" This is just getting worse and worse!

PS I degrade no one. You degrade yourself.

PS I am working on a possible idea (maybe a book) where I rile people up and watch their response. You have some good comments here that reflect what may happen when you upset a board full of mostly atheists. Thanks so much for your input and help. I appreciate it.

I find it fascinating that people can get so upset about some fairly lukewarm comments and take them so personally in what is basically an anonymous arena.

RJ Johnson

How long are you going to prattle on with your nonsense? You said you were done long ago and yet there you are!!

Cruizn21,

You seem pretty interested in me.

But if that is your only comment, dig a little deeper, will you please? Please!

RJ

Dig deeper? Why? All I see is your massive ego. It is really boring. Your ability to see beyond yourself is a waste of everyone's time and energy.

I used to see and listen to those like you in the 60's on NYC street corners.

Get yourself unstuck from your own silly little universe.

You said you were out of here long ago, and yet we cannot get rid of you.

So much for your word. In the universe it is worthless.

RJ, and Jake, please read. It'll be quick.

I've spent the last half hour or so going through all of these comments. I've read them from beginning to end. I started to get tired of hearing RJ's empty, childish comments after a while, but was interested in what the thinking people, believers or not, had to say. And I have to admit, it was Jake the high-schooler who finally laid out the truth for all of us. Everyone was trying to deal with RJ, some trying to help him out, just as Jake said, but R.J, - you just don't listen. It's really unfortunate. And the truth is . . . you kind of are an a#@hole. Why is it that you can hear that from virtually everybody who has read your comments, yet you refuse to see it?

The reason so many comments have been about you is that you keep jumping in, and we're all annoyed that you're more interested in drawing attention to yourself than engaging in the conversation that the rest of us are having.

This isn't always a foolproof method of living, but if 90% of the people around you are saying the same thing about you, it's probably worth stepping back and asking yourself "Gosh, I wonder if this might be true?"

I applaud Sam Harris as well as the believers who are willing to listen to him without having a knee-jerk reaction. I applaud all the thinking people of the world. And I think maybe Jake could be our next prophet.

Cruiz,

If it's such a waste of time, why do you waste your time?

Nancy,

I thought you said you'd be quick. :)

And you actually have the free time to read all this stuff? Amazing.

Actually, I have made my self an easy target to see how you'd all react. It has been truly interesting in strange sort of way.

Kate,

Grow up and give the ad hominems a rest. Sam Harris has thoroughly researched every major religious text, especially the Bible and the Gnostic Gospels (which is clearly more than you can say for yourself). Look at the footnotes to his book. Actually, any book for that matter. You might actually learn something.

Nancy,

PS Does this mean we are not meeting for coffee tonight? Just wondering.

Michelle,

You lost me at the "Grow up" line. Come on, you can do better than that!

Hugs....

RJ!!!:

RJ - I didn't know that a half hour constituted a whole lot of free time. And we all know that you didn't set this up as an experiment. Like many, many, many others before me have said, can you please comment about what Sam Harris has to say? If your comments are only about the interviewer, we've heard them already. You don't have to say them again. Please contribute in a useful way.

Nancy,

Oh, much of this is truly a social experiment. Yes, indeed.

And my beef is with Patt Morrison. And this amount of comments will get her attention.

Nancy dear, does this mean no coffee tonight. You, me and latte?

When I was 12, I thought that someday our progeny would look back at our beliefs and laugh much as we now laugh at the flat earth conception. Fifty years later, I still think so.

As we gain information old beliefs make way for new realities. As it has been in our past, so it will be in our future.

Just take a deep breath and wait for the facts to clear the air.

In the meantime, be tolerant but keep chipping away at the more obvious B.S. in a sensitive fashion. No one enjoying looking foolish.

RJ, once again you have nothing to say about Sam Harris. That is why we are all here. And yes, probably this amount of comments will get Patt Morrison's attention . . . and how embarrassing for you if it does. I'll check back tomorrow to see if anyone else has something interesting to say, as that is why I came here in the first place.

Vicelike,

You were thinking about the flat Earth conception when you were 12? 12?

Wild.

re: (re fundie-troll RJJohnson) "ur right, i dont have any credentials, im in high school. what im saying is that ur credential are irrelevant in what im trying to point out."

LOL - Jake, that was one of the best pwnage comments EVAR! That should (but sadly "won't") make that fundie-fossil examine his self-worth.

RJ

Maybe I need to reduce this to something that you can relate to. Trite, but fitting.

From the Eagles. Just remember this, my girl, when you look up in the sky
You can see the stars and still not see the light.

I think they were more enlightened than you.

Then even Jules Renard got through. "I don't know if God exists, but it would be better for His reputation if He didn't"

Bottom line. Yes, Christ lived. An incredible man with an incredible message FOR HIS TIME!!

Does not make him god, or confirmation of the existence of a supreme being.

Maybe people are hard wired to believe in a supreme being, and that does not mean that one exists.

Try watching 'The Universe'. Just sit back and let it in.

Then think about the massive deaths at the hands of religious fanatics over human history. All in the name of someone's god.

Probably yours. You are as stuck in that crap as anyone that I have ever seen.

When you get that 'This is it. There is nothing to get.' You will find that you can finally live and live free.

Even Eddie Izzard gets it for crying out loud!!

The Universe is powerful. Stars are born and die over the eons. The earth is 4.5 BILLION YEARS OLD! We all know that it will be consumed by the sun in another few billion years.

Humans have a chance to make something of themselves if they can get past killing one another in the name of your god.

Cruiz,

You are quoting the Eagles and Eddie Izzard? Wow! The funny thing is so much of what you say about me is in your head...made up...imagined. I have said almost nothing here about what I believe in...in terms of your reaction here. It's just in your mind! LOL

pownage,

You sound like "Clerks 3"

We are almost at 200 posts. You grumpy guys can do it! 2 more!

RJ

Thank you for making my point. Look back over your comments and those that have commented to you.

YOU HAVE NOTHING TO CONTRIBUTE!!

There is no enlightenment that you could possible obtain.

You are some sad relic of religious fervor that keeps the human race stuck in endless violence and superstition.

Once again I am not surprised by the lack of quality comments however I am disappointed as ever in the reasons for disagreeing with the Sam Harris point of view.
There are few humans educated or not, that like to be proved wrong. Especially when it comes to any discussions about their religion .
Most do not have problems with discussions about other religions having hugh gaps of truth.
Author Robin Wright in his book titled The Evolution of GOD takes painful steps to outline how and when "we" modern humans formed our current belief systems. Once a person serious about the Philosophy of Religion understands how the human brain learns and then locks in information no matter what that quality of information is -it's almost impossible to dislodge it.
Charlie Rose is running a five part series on the human brain and this series reinforces how "we learn". Again it has little to do with MAAT or Truth.
I predict my Great Grandchildren will have a much clearer understanding of the origin of heaven and hell and why it will not pass the test of time.

This subject always boils down to the same basic point: Religious people stomp their feet and shake their fists but never, never, NEVER provide any sort of evidence for their claims while relying on circular logic, ignoring inconsistencies and rationalizing everything that comes to their senses. Nobody on earth is as fearful as religious people. They fear letting go, they fear NOT believing, they fear being alone with their thoughts, they fear the god they created, they fear free thought and they fear to look outside their own worldview. The burden of proof is on those who make claims. A religionist cannot prove god or the supernatural or any of its supposed outcomes.

This comment, written by Kate above, is a common sentiment: "I can't respect anyone who denys religion when clearly he has not studied it or understands it at all." I can only say that it's obvious that a person making this statement has not read Harris's books or listened to him speak. He is well versed in religion and has studied texts more than most religionists. There is no end to the outrageous comments people make that are based on nothing short of ignorance and denial.

Out of all the posters on atheist websites that I have seen in the last 6 months, I have never seen one as ridiculous as RJ. I stopped about half way down the thread so I'm not sure how much more ridiculous he became. I'm sure he was starting to make fun of himself although he didn't really have to. He was already making fun of himself without knowing it when he started those first few posts.
Religulous!
Sam Harris is brilliant. So reasonable. He seems to get more convincingly articulate every time I hear him ... at the opposite end of the reason (and bluster) scale from RJ.

"He clearly does not understand what all the major prophets have taught."

You clearly don't understand that you believe in a farce!

One interview like this can help people unlearn all the programming that millions preachers and teachers have done. Leep educating Sam. Awaiting your new book, hope every word in it is packed with wisdom.
Warm regards
S.Aiyer

I'm a big fan of Sam Harris. He presented atheism so convincingly in a cable TV program that I watched a few years ago that I feel comfortable telling others about my atheism. If you're a Christian, just search youtube for Muslim videos telling you how wrong you are and how they worship the one true god and they practice the only religion accepted by god. And they REALLY, REALLY believe that.

I find it hard to believe that I'm living in a world where there are so many "Flat Earth People".
I think religion is the greatest threat to our future as a species.
If we cannot get over this Stone age belief system I think we are doom to Could Have Beens.
The Abrahamic books are full of just so much evil and I should know as I've read and studied every word over and over.
M.Leyland

R.J.
I know exactly who you are.
You are the troll who goes by "Willie***" on youtube.
Same old crap posted on all of Sam and Richard Dawkins videos.

Leos,

Wrong again... :)

R.J.

Please tell me one thing I have said here about religion or God...?

It is all in your minds! LOL

Oh, you can be a grumpy bunch.

But at least we made 200 posts...

You have done well, grasshoppahs.

Marcos,

It's all a 15th century slapstick comedy? Really?

I think Bob Dylan still believes in God. So, you have Sam Harris and Bob Dylan. I'm going with Dylan.

What a marvelous interview! Regardless of the topic, it was refreshing to hear a position argued from a clearly articulated, rational position instead of the typical emotional rants, appeals to "tradition" (or "institutionalized ignorance," to some) and otherwise vacuous arguments that muddle the public discourse.

Not sure why he won't go all the way...religious people are deluded and prone to lower intelligence than non-believers. If you arrived on earth today and examined the evidence for religion, you would have to be a moron to believe in any religion over any other (or, in fact, over the Rock's new Tooth Fairy movie).

A quick rebuttal.

R.J. Johnson:
"'God,'

You forgot Definition #4.

'you, or a dictionary?' Why the comma? It's always humorous to see someone on one of these blogs being so critical of others in terms of punctuation and they make all kinds of mistakes in their own writing. LOL

1) Spelling is not grammar. The grammar of the post I was referring to is actually decent, but the spelling is undeniably atrocious. With such terrible spelling, I am naturally skeptical of comprehension.

2) Commas can be used to emphasize contrast. I used the comma to highlight the absurdity of the comparison.

3) There is no other dictionary-recognized definition of interview as a noun which deviates beyond the average meaning of the three which I provided. You're free to use your own definition of "interview" as you wish, just don't expect to convince anyone to accept it after hearing such weak arguments.

4) It's clear by your profuse usage of "LOL" and lack of real intellectual engagement that you aren't even trying to be taken seriously. Therefore this is the last time I will note your existence.

Goodbye.

Who's this God bloke & where does he live? Who are these pretentious prophet people that wrote that book of jokes called the Bible?

Could someone please get these religious people some psychiatric help? they need closure!

As always Sam clamly, intelligently and simply exposes religion for what it is - a delusion that saps the mind of the ability to reason and produces so much evil in the world. I've read everyhting Sam has ever written and look forward to more.

By the way, I stopped reading that RJ guy's posts about half way through the posts. What a bore!

Best wishes to Sam and all clear thinkers - reason encourages our inate leaning towards the good; it is what stands beteen civilisation and barbarism.

And RJ don't waste ur breath about the typos in my last post. It's boring!

Sam Harris makes perfect sense and hopefully makes the deluded religious think again about the brainwashing, anti-feminism and futility of religion.

Keep up the good work Sam ... the world needs more free thinkers like you.

At this point RJ Johnson has made 70 assorted comments - none interesting. He is a troll and the only way to deal with trolls - religious or otherwise - is to ignore them.

Their purpose is to post as many short and incomprehensible comments as possible in an attempt to get the ire of other posters.

Some post interminably long and incomprehensible comments in an attempt to pseudo engage others in an apparent exchange of 'ideas'. This always, without exception, goes nowhere.

Trolls do not come onto comment threads to do anything except disrupt. There is no honesty or openness in any comment they make - their sole purpose is disruption.

I never talk directly to trolls - it feeds their egos that they are being taken notice of. I will talk about trolls briefly in order to point out the futility of addressing them directly and assuming they are serious in their endeavours. They are not.

Unfortunately for the rest of us, those who do make the mistake (over and over again I notice) of addressing trolls, the great majority of the comment threads get derailed and end up as verbiage.

Please, don't rise to the bait (flimsy as it is anyway) thrown out by trolls; resist addressing them and, if possible, don't read their posts. This makes it easier to scroll down and ignore them completely.

In great hope and with heartfelt thanks
V

Basically, Veronique is saying - DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS.

Seriously, people. It's like tossing scraps to a pigeon. The dirty little thing will just keep coming back... which is annoying.

Just want to know what Sam Harris means by 'good'? He never defines it. His point that you do not need to be religious to be good is incomplete. WHat does he mean by good and how do we decide what 'good' is?

I think his argument is flawed at this point. Maybe we don't need religion to be good, but how do we agree on what is good?

R.J. Johnson:

"I have produced award-winning TV programs for PBS primetime and I know what I'm talking about here."

Well my dad can beat up your dad.

What an excellent thinker and speaker Sam Harris is! His on-the-spot clarity is truly enviable, saying all those things someone like myself would love to say, but don't ever get the chance.
With people like Harris around, it gives me hope that the evil tyranny of religion will one day collapse.

Sam, I believe if a person tries to do what is right under divine principle and if there is a creator, he will reveal him or herself to us. If we are embryonic God's in the making then we can attain the power which is the substance of pure faith from above. Mankind needs unity in their thinking, because we are all going in many different directions spiritually speaking. Every action that we take is based on more faith or less faith, but is still faith. Faith is a fire a blue ray quality of divine love. Every aspect of divine fire can be restored to us personally. The soul will return to the celestial realms of light when the soul has become restored to her lighthood or christhood.The soul must grow fat in light. The soul must overcome the carnal mind and the human ego and become one with the super-conscious ego or mind of God. There are many different paths that can return us to the source. The real name of God is I Am that I Am, which was revealed to moses in the burning bush that was not consumed. Each soul has her own I Am pressence and each star differeth in glory. My God identity is different then your God identity. Everyone has a personal God. There is one God, but one, times one, times one...always equels one.

Nick says "I think his [Sam's] argument is flawed at this point. Maybe we don't need religion to be good, but how do we agree on what is good?"

Nick, we know naturally (unless we're psychopaths)what good and bad are. I know I like people to be kind to me. I am grateful when someone helps me. I know those actions are good. On the other hand, I wouldn't like my things stolen and I know I don't like being mugged. I'm sure I wouldnb't like to be raped much less murdered. And I can extrapolate from that and say , well, I gues the next person wouldn't like those things done to them either so they must be not good and I won't do them to anybody. I don't need religion to tell me It's good to be good and bad to be bad anymore than I need religion to tell me what is good and bad. I know naturally. It's not rocket science, just common sense.

Hard to be an atheist: Eight reasons

http://thinkpoint.wordpress.com/2007/02/23/not-easy-to-be-an-atheist/

I hope there is no God:

http://thinkpoint.wordpress.com/2008/12/03/i-hope-there-is-no-god-thomas-nagel/

Steve Cornell

His immediate basis is wrong - the moral foundation of society is not a valid reason for belief, but truth is. The bottom line regarding faith: is it true? Are the claims of the faith system true? Solving poverty, education, or resistance to diseases are not hard facts and thus, evolution is blind to culture, government and the scientific method as Harris admits. Mutual Altruism - the "selfish gene" does and can give a type of "moral code". Belief is content independent - that is why the basis for faith must be truth, not a justification for social justice.

Yes,, Fuller Ming
And there is no truth in the knowledge claims faith systems make. Therfore we can discard them as bases for morality. Much better to use our inherited common sense. No need for a doctorate in philosophy to work out what is good and bad. we just need reason.

"I think his argument is flawed at this point. Maybe we don't need religion to be good, but how do we agree on what is good?"

This is a point that others have pointed to in Sam's arguments and ideas, but not so much on "What is good"...but more "What is happiness for a human being and what is the best environment and conditions for humans to be happy and prosper?" He's just arguing that science, reason, and moral philosophy are better tools to use in trying to discover the best conditions for human happiness.

http://thesciencenetwork.org/programs/beyond-belief-science-religion-reason-and-survival

http://thesciencenetwork.org/programs/beyond-belief-enlightenment-2-0/sam-harris

I'm sure you have seen these discussions already but just in case you have not here they are. Great listening if you have the time.

Yes, maximus444, I think you are absoutley right, science reason etc are the best (perhaps we should say the only) tools to use in trying to discover the best conditions for human happiness. And promoting those conditions is 'good'.

And thanks for those links. They are great listening and I recommend them to others.

Cheers

Yes Sams books are a must read. They are very enlightening and entertaining at the same time.

Long before I came to know of Sam Harris I already believed that Religion is a mental desease. Now the three major religions are getting ready to blow up MY SIDE of the damn planet. That is plain rude seeing as how I don't believe in their fairy tale. And I'm not supposed to complain. I Swear I'm going to make a bumper sticker that says, "Jesus, 2000yr old TROUBLE MAKER. New Romans: 1

Wanna bet I'd get pulled over by every Cop who loved Jesus?

Folks...watch Ziegist The Movie. Google it. You'll see that saviours all have one thing in common....the stars! You see they didn't have TV back then.

Great interview Sam

He hits the nail on the head about morality. The way Sam puts it doesn't sound confrontational or argumentative. Just obvious. "The emperor has no clothes." I'm going to share this interview and I can't wait to read his next book.

But I don't agree that evolution doesn't explain culture or political structure, etc. Wouldn't there be an evolutionary advantage to skills and inclination to team-build (hence organizations), and isn't there an evolutionary advantage in creating smaller groups (cultures) within which there is more *iterative interaction? I'm more with Dawkins on this point.

I do not think that good and bad, right or wrong are the markers.

If you look more at what works and what does not work in the universe or in life, then it becomes clearer.

Killing, lying, stealing do not work. YOU lose your way, hence your life. I do not think that I need to elaborate.

If your ability to be in the moment is gone, your aliveness is gone.

How to get humans past religiosity seems to me to be the real point. The death marches of Islam today and over the centuries will need to somehow be addressed. The toll that they are taking in the world is staggering.

The Christian right is not much different. Maybe not as much outright killing, but it certainly does not set the stage for peace.

Code of conduct- ie Reason and the Reason Project certainly are a directional move toward getting the world to work for everyone.

Still, how to get people past their religious beliefs is going to be a challenge.

maximus444 thanks for mentioning The Science Network. I consider it a nice find, something like TED.com. Thanks again.

Does Sam seriously think his actions will make religion disappear? Or even less common? Yes, religion is unnecessary, especially for him and the other smart people who have posted here. But his insistence that is is universally harmful, even for those who don't try to force others to adopt their beliefs, is the main reason he and his friends are ineffective in helping wipe out organized religion's more obnoxious features. It reminds me of the right wing attacks, in the 2008 campaign, on Obama as a wild eyed socialist radical, when it was obvious he wasn't.

Someone needs to remember that the "major prophets" were just men born of women. Religion was invented to keep people in line...especially from the patriachial point of view.Just never forget how the pilgrims switched from religion to profit when there was buck to be made. Sooo unscientific...soooo trouble-causing sooo limiting in world view.

Ricky - I think the biggest thing Sam is up against is the pure amount of time that it will take to wipe out religion. I think his firm and rational stance is what we need as a beginning. It has to start somewhere. Just like the first white person who stood for civil rights for blacks, just like the first gay person who was proud and open, just like the first woman who fought for the vote. These things take time, and unfortunately I think having rationality replace religion will take longer than the aforementioned movements put together . . . and then some. It won't happen in our lifetimes, but I'm glad it's beginning to take hold.

Very interesting view of the world and religion in general.
I too feel that a lot of time and effort is wasted on religion where it could be used in a more constructive manner. ie. learning about how the earth really formed and came to be as it is today. Nothing in the bible, and I have read it all, can do that. It has nothing to do with god,and everything to do with the thinking and customs of the people who wrote it some 2000 years ago. A 'living fossil' that is long overdue for extinction.
I look forward to his new book, and think more people should give his opinions a chance. They make sense when you step back and actually take the time think about how bizarre religion is. I'm glad I did.

If the timeline of the logic presented here is true, then years to come, the teachings of Sam Harris will also be considered passe, out-of-date and people will mentally evolve to some other way of thinking. Interesting.

Again, Bob Dylan believes in God and Sam Harris does not. And you wouldn't go with Dylan? No?

And you know Patt Morrison is thinking, look at all these comments. I have to book that Sam Harris guy every week!

Ha!

To Dr. Harris:
Thank you for enlightening us all. It's too bad that many people hear you but they don't listen to you, because of their lack or inability to reason. Keep in mind that I and, judging by the comments, many more listen to you. Thanks also for giving us hope, at the end of the interview, for a secular world that depends on science to answer the important questions.

To theists, apologists, et al:
Don't think for one nanosecond that an atheist is some blissful ignoramus with poor habits. Although atheists are as unique as DNA and it's hard to generalize, an atheist is usually someone who has reasonably looked at the evidence for supernaturalism, including, but not limited to, religion, and has said to themselves, "I don't believe it, and I don't need that to live a happy and fulfilling life. And that's all I have—this life,” or something along these lines.

You could try to change an atheist's mind about that, but you would necessarily have to offer accurate evidence, that could be sensed by anyone at anytime, and that doesn't come from a book or was written thousands of years ago. If you can offer such proof, then you should speak up, and you will see the likes of Dr. Harris, Prof. Dawkins, and others running to retract their previous statements of disbelieve.

If, on the other hand, you cannot, then either start looking for such evidence, or, keep your beliefs to your self. Please do not bring them into the public context, and please don’t try to change atheists since you would be wasting your time.

Nancy, Sam has nothing new to say. Atheism has been popular, among intellectuals, since pre-Socratic Greece. The danger from religion arises, not from the masses spending time and money indulging themselves with it, but from the usage of it to run public policy and international relations. For most practitioners, religion is just a form of entertainment and therapy. By going after that Harris, Hitchens, Dawkins, etc., are alienating more people than they are gaining in the laudable effort to rid the public domain of its influence.

Sam Harris said that he was raised by a Jewish mother and a Quaker father, and he told Newsweek that as a child, he "declined to be bar mitzvahed." But Harris told Bill Maher that he grew up in a secular home and his parents never discussed God.

Huh? If this is true, something is very wrong here! Very wrong!

Some "truths" stand the test of time, some don't. We used to believe in bloodletting as a medical practice, but have since changed our minds. But once we discovered that the Earth is round and not flat, it stayed that way. I don't think we are going to evolve out of that belief. Atheism is purely the lack of active belief in an invisible, personal God. Atheism is actually a human's default belief system - it is religion that needs to be taught and persuaded. Nobody needs to teach a human to not believe in what there is no evidence for.

Ricky, you're right about atheism having been around forever, but I think Sam has a new way of presenting it to the masses. And he is studying the neuropsychology of beliefs and happiness, which I think will be very interesting to learn from.

One of his points about the danger of religion is that, because so many people cling to it, it has become taboo for anyone to question it. Because so many people think it is just there because it's comforting to them, we are not allowed to question it for fear of being, I don't know, rude? This in turn makes it taboo to question religion as a whole, and we all agree that religion is also one of the major reasons we have so much pain in the world, right?

And changes are occurring, because the percentage of atheists is on the rise - it's a slow rise, but it's a steady one.

Sam Harris is very knowledgeable about religion, morality, and neuroscience. He's right. Religion is irrelevant to morality.

Nancy, I suppose we will have to agree to disagree. Will classical music gain more adherents if its lovers publicly denounced rock and roll as noise for idiots? I see little influence of the current crop of militant atheists on those who might influence Muslim countries to completely separate Mosque and State and other goals we would agree that the world would be better off if they happened.

Wow, what a smart and thoughtful person Sam Harris is!!! So clear that science and free thinking is the best way, and the correct way to solve moral problems, and how harmful religious dogma is to solving suffering. Religion seems to revel in suffering!

Huh?

Sam Harris said that he was raised by a Jewish mother and a Quaker father, and he told Newsweek that as a child, he "declined to be bar mitzvahed." But Harris told Bill Maher that he grew up in a secular home and his parents never discussed God.

Huh? If this is true, something is very wrong here! Very wrong!

OhMy!

Yes, OhMy! What's up with that?

Hey, OhMy - can you not see how those things you mention are consistent?

the fact that his quaker father and mother married in the first place supports the idea that they would raise him in a secular home.

Sam's the best rational thinker out there and this was an excellent interview. He can eviscerate religious mumbo jumbo at 100 paces.

sane1,

What? A Jewish wife and a Quaker husband who never discussed God? But obviously someone mentioned the old bar mitzvah, didn't they! Hello?

No response to this? Hmmmm....

If the timeline of the logic presented here is true, then years to come, the teachings of Sam Harris will also be considered passe, out-of-date and people will mentally evolve to some other way of thinking.

OHMy, a Baptist once told me his son, jealous of the presents his friends were getting, was begging for a Bar Mitzvah. There is much more to religion than theology.

Ricky,

But that has nothing to do with what I said about Sam Harris' childhood:

What? A Jewish wife and a Quaker husband who never discussed God? But obviously someone mentioned the old bar mitzvah, didn't they! Hello?

OhMy!, Richard Dawkins says that he is a cultural Christian and likes Christmas carols. What would be wrong with a non religious couple having a religious ceremony and party related to the religion of the ancestors of the wife? It certainly could be decided on without God being mentioned.

But we are not talking about Richard Dawkins.

And you just assume they were a non-religious couple.

Your logic does not follow. The argument is pretty thin.

OhMy - OhPlease. You have picked an exactly pointless point to argue, Stop splitting hairs and listen to Harris and his arguments. Is there actually anything in this interview that you can disprove? Forget about his parents "never" mentioning god. Even if he actually said that (which I doubt), it makes no difference to any important argument.

Rickey,

A Jewish mother - a discussion about a bar mitzvah - and no talk of God? Do you really believe that? What a hoot!

Ah, sane1,

If the timeline of the logic presented here is true, then years to come, the teachings of Sam Harris will also be considered passe, out-of-date and people will mentally evolve to some other way of thinking.

Ricky,

Re: (your words) Forget about his parents "never" mentioning god. Even if he actually said that (which I doubt)

Wait. So, Bill Maher faked the interview where Sam Harris said that he grew up in a secular home and his parents never discussed God? Ah, OK...?

Folks
Stay on target. That a#$hole RJ throws something out and you bite?

Do you believe everything that some rabble rousing idiot throws into the mix?

Will we ever be able to have a dialog and get anywhere when people like him are listened to?

Read previous posts before you enter responses.

Cruzin21,

If the timeline of the logic presented here is true, then years to come, the teachings of Sam Harris will also be considered passe, out-of-date and people will mentally evolve to some other way of thinking. no, comment, eh?

Thank you for a great broadcast. It was truly refreshing to hear a conversation about reason and not delusional dogma. Very, very sadly we are the most religious of 1st world nations. The number of people suffering from this disease (faith in an omnipotent creator) is a great obstacle to humanity's progress. Dr. Harris' comment about reasonable people no longer keeping a straight face when people spout off opinions based on their delusions couldn't come at a better time. It is sad indeed that so many around the world do not see the danger of blind devotion. Not even when their own lives are made worse by it. I hope to hear more from Dr. Harris and his colleagues. Thanks NPR.

DirectorMina,

So, how did this whole universe thing get started in the first place? I hope to hear more form you soon.

I've been a Christian all my life. Recently I've been considering my beliefs and I can honestly say for the first time, after hearing this radio segment, that I am no longer a Christian. This was one of many stepping stones, but I just finished listening and this is the first time I can fully realize my atheism. Thank you Sam.

Robert - So you now believe in Sam Harris?

Robert. What if Sam Harris is just another intelllectual hukster who wants to become famous and wealthy by selling books on a controversial subject that will certainly get him attention?

Sometimes this stuff here sounds like Scientologists talking about L. Ron Hubbard.

OpenMind,

Of course not. It's questions like that that have equally led me away from my religion. No where in my post did I come anywhere close to implying that, but instead of replying with a remotely relevant question you ask something like that? Do you really think being snide to me is going to make me rediscover God?

NewGuy,

He isn't selling anything more than his opinions. He isn't promising keys to an afterlife. People buy his books expecting his opinions, not magic. There's a key difference.

And I wouldn't pay any attention to him if I didn't already agree with what he was saying. He's also not the only atheist in the world. Like I said, he's one of many stepping stones. Stepping stones that include other atheists but mostly my own internal reasoning.

I will no longer be posting here. If anyone tries to continue replying as though they are me, they are an impostor.

Thanks,

Robert.

@Robert,

Welcome to the rational world. Even if you aren't posting here any more, I hope you read for a little while longer and pick up this message from me.

I am sure that others join with me and say to you happy freedom and now comes the work of training yourself.

Best of luck. Come over the Richard Dawkins' site. You may enjoy Ben Goldacre's Bad Science. You will find a lot of literature to enjoy.

Welcome
V

Robert... I don't believe that I or anyone else can "bring you back to God." Only God can do that.

I just asked a question and you seemed to get pretty defensive.

Still no comment on this.... Hmmmmm:

If the timeline of the logic presented here is true, then years to come, the teachings of Sam Harris will also be considered passe, out-of-date and people will mentally evolve to some other way of thinking.

To RJ Johnson

Have you ever thought that the only reason you don't murder and rape people are because you believe that your god is real. Keep the faith; I hope Sam Harris never succeeds in making you realize that religion is just bullshiit. I hate to think the crimes you would commit if you ever lost your faith. I say this because you believe that people who don’t believe in a god; they must lack morals. Then the opposite must be true. People who have morals only because they believe in a god. Keep the faith.

Iggy Los Angeles

What a bunch of weenies!! Nobody cares about or respects what anyone else thinks about religion; just read the diversity of these comments. Everybody thinks they're right!

I've been an agnostic since childhood(yes-I was raised in a "Christian" home). I used to argue with religious people all the time about all this silliness when I was younger. Now I'm in my forties, and I just interrupt them and politely tell them I don't discuss personal issues in public...period.

By the way, I remember a time when no one displayed their so-called "faith" in public. It just wasn't polite behavior unless you were a white-trash moron. Can we try to get back to that? I didn't start seeing people praying in restaurants until about 15 years ago. And I'm in the South!

This was a great interview. I've since looked at other venues that Sam Harris has spoken and like his reasoning. I also like other speakers at TED; you should check out their website: www.ted.com
I want to thank those of you whom stayed focused on topic of discussion and ignored the attention whores on this blog, keep ignoring them.

Iggy......You seem place a lot of judgements on people. That atheism thing has so much tolerance. And you complain about the believers?????

There is so much name-calling here. At least with church people the odds are better some may show a little love. Bye!

eggman - but then who created the chicken?

Great interview, thanks!!

I hope to one day meet Sam Harris and shake his hand.

I hope never to meet R.J. Johnson.

Amen rustywheeler! RJ, I responded to your "timeline" paragraph right after the first time you wrote it. I guess you didn't like the response, because you keep saying the same thing over and over again, as if you had won an argument or something.

Sorry to the rest of you that I fed the troll, as I had joined you in our lovely but short-lived hiatus in which we actually discussed interesting and relevant things while ignoring the intrusions. I will do my best to return to the boycott.

And please, troll, I'm already one step ahead of you on "amen." Don't bother.

Ricky, thanks for being such a good example of how to completely disagree with someone and be respectful and kind while doing it. Very cool.

Nancy, your reply was: Some "truths" stand the test of time, some don't.

That's basically it? Really? Ah, OK?

Nancy, the "amen" was a nice touch. A theological Freudian-type slip. And from one so far ahead of me, too! Cool.

rustlywheeler, you live up to the squeaky one getting the most grease.

But don't be so mean and cruel. I would think one as confident as yourself would be more joyful? No?

PS Nancy, atheism has been around for thousands and thousands of years. I think if it was going to become the dominant "philosophy," that would've happened by now. The American 8% is 8% for probably a very good reason.

92% of the people look at the night sky and think...hmmmmm..."Something must have, in some way, some how, 'created' this."

:)

R.J.

The dialogue that follows, after someone like Sam Harris or Richard Dawkins speaks, is sadly predictable. People, like”R.J. Johnson ” generally engage in nothing more than a series of smug ad hominem attacks intended (I presume) to prove their own worldview by attempting to discredit their adversary’s character or scholarly understanding. It is very tedious, and is probably the reason why these forums are generally an inadequate place for meaningful dialogue. Every 10 or 20 comments, someone without an axe to grind, and an honest interest in approaching more closely to an “asymptote of truth” will pipe in with an appropriate comment. The rest is, sad to say, irrelevant hyperbole or inane criticism. Sam Harris, if you have studied his work, articulates a very thoughtful, reflective, and compassionate interpretation of reality. He deserves our respect and thoughtful consideration. The angry diatribes that his talks generate in response serve only to discredit their authors.

What a wonderful interview, a little light hearted here and there and full of thought provoking content.

Definitely passing this on to friends and family. Thank you.

Always a pleasure to listen to Sam - a reasoned and thoughtful approach to the religious mess our world is in. Trouble is, sometimes people prefer not to listen to reason.

But, what's the story with Sam and Bill Stiller, the likeness is remarkable (till they open their mouths).

RJ Johnson,
You are an amazing bore. How's that for an ad-hominem?

Why do you even care what the sheep think as long as they follow the shepherd?
If organized religion taught us anything, it is that society can function very well, perhaps best, when most of the people perform up to our expectations of them as followers. The pundits, pastors and presidents can put on their little show for the people but behind that we know whose in charge an what the agenda really is. These new media atheists are ruining this gig for all of us. Alternatively, they are helping to misdirect people from endeavors into finding out what is really going on.
To Those intelligent atheists out there, forget this crusade. You aren't the prophets of a new age but the rebellious scions of power. Right now you think it is a bad thing, once you learn to bend it to your ends your opinion will change. People don't want to think for themselves, most can't. People follow smart and charismatic people, atheist and religious. You can have your fun now but you won't break your means of power.

So why is he standing next to a "Christmas" tree???

Susan, I have heard Sam say that he enjoys the secular side of Christmas. Lots of us grew up with Christmas as a holiday that didn't really emphasize religion, and it has more and more become cultural rather than sacred (all about being jolly, spending time with family, giving gifts to those you love, etc.etc.). Probably a shame for very religious Christians, the way the emphasis has changed, but that's what we humans do. Heck, we look forward to buying a new mattress on President's Day. What?

wen Alimitee Jesus cums back to erth to reclaim huminkind foah God, this heah sam haris charactur gonna burn in hel mos showly he izz. i aint nevah hurd such sinful blaisphemin an heeretical poysin since i cummed tuh this sodom & gomorah that is californee.

y'all bettah bee changin yo'z tune mitee kwik, ah'z can be tellin y'all, coz tha lawds vengins is mitee an he sho ain't gonna be showin enee mercee tuh yo suckahs!... no siree bob aun' jemimah's pancakes he ain't - yo ALL gonna burn when tha END TIME cummeth, an tha day of judgin is rite own yo sorry asses!!!
Jus aks tha good reverind Patrisha Robitsun. Yo kin find him in his blud-diamund mine in the hart of darkniss - tha belgin congo (or whatever it's dadblamed name is rite now) protectin those peeples owt there frum makin thah same devil-pact mistake that those heathins an voodoo wurshippers in hai-iti did.
God bless America (evin includin Californee)!

BJR99

And no one here really responded to this: Sam Harris said that he was raised by a Jewish mother and a Quaker father, and he told Newsweek that as a child, he "declined to be bar mitzvahed." But Harris told Bill Maher that he grew up in a secular home and his parents never discussed God.

I think you need a hug!

I know Nancy does. :)

R.J.

Comment #300!!!!

This could be a record?

Comment #301!!!

A new record!!!

BTW - I'm very encouraged that there are people like Sam Harris out there trying to apply reason and logic where it's sorely needed.

Ted N. - And I thought it was just Obama.

Sam Harris enjoys the secular side of Christmas? If he's celebrating any part of CHRISTmas, then, to me, there really is no secular side. I think the spirit is in all of the elements and rituals.

Sam Harris enjoys the secular side of Christmas? Really? To me, that's like celebrating Mother's Day for the brunch.

Duff, to be an "amazing bore"? - Isn't that kind of a contradiction in terms...?

Me likey them ad-hominy grits down south.

R.J.

OpenMind (gotta love the incongruity of THAT name), you're holding onto the Fallacy of the First Cause. Remember, time is infinite in BOTH directions, and everything that causes something itself is caused by what went before. What caused the Big Bang? We don't know. What came before the Big Bang? We don't know. We may never know. But "don't know" does NOT equate to "goddidit."

Sam Harris is the best. His book "The End of Faith" is one of my favorites, but his "Letter to a Christian Nation" is a really great short read as well. Thanks for this interview! Science rules!

And why is a secular christmas so hard to swallow? It's not as if Christians originated the damn holiday, co-opting Saturnalia, Winter Solstice, Yule and any number of other mid-winter festivals. People can and do bring what meaning they wish to any celebration. I celebrate Thanksgiving, too--but it's not god I'm thanking for the bounty, it's my boss I'm thankful to for both hiring me and paying me enough to throw a feast.

there are....no gods, no devils, no angels, no demons,,no heaven no hell no limbo no purgatory..no holy animal crackers no virgin births..no witches to burn.. no heresy no walking on water..no resurrected zombies .no mohamiid flying on his pig to heaven and no 72 vigin whores waiting when you blow your stupid ass up...peace...chaz

chaz darwin. Oh, yeah. Prove it!

gary from philly... but you equate everything to "goddidn'tdoit." Same Dogma, different pew.

Funny how you all seem to avoid this issue (other than the silly attempt to try and deny it ever happened):

Sam Harris said that he was raised by a Jewish mother and a Quaker father, and he told Newsweek that as a child, he "declined to be bar mitzvahed." But Harris told Bill Maher that he grew up in a secular home and his parents never discussed God.

to ohmy...it easy...what is is.! what is not is not !...what is it?...do you understand ? ..of course you don't...peace chaz

chaz darwin. As I thought. You probably really don't know what you're talking about. Cool. Thanks for the insight.

OhMy! Not quite--though the difference may be too subtle for you to grasp. What I as a non-theist am saying is that there is no evidence that "goddidit," nor, as science is constantly discovering, is it necessary for there to be a god for something to get done. As we now know that Zeus is not responsible for lightning, Thor is not responsible for thunder, and Yahweh didn't bring on the Black Plague. The "dogma" as you insist on calling it is not just saying "god didn't do it," but rather to actually figure out what causes something, rather than just assuming whenever we don't know (or understand) an answer that god did it.

OH ME OH MY ? ..YOU ARE VERY WELCOME. GREAT FUN TALKING TO YOU...BYE NOW..PEACE..CHAZ

"For example, did you ever think that an atheist might not kill others for fear of going to PRISON. You didn't even mention that!" - RJ Johnson

Are you serious? I used to visit my Dad in prison, he was a minister who thought tax fraud was his duty to god. 99% of people in prison in the US self-identified as followers of a god.

So just in case you missed that RJ, 99% of people in prison including my god loving father are christian, muslim and jews. Where are all those godless atheists?

We are teaching your children to be less retarded than you and Mrs. Palin!

""In view of such harmony in the cosmos which I, with my limited human mind, am able to recognize, there are yet people who say there is no God. But what really makes me angry is that they quote me for the support of such views."!" - RJ Johnson quoting Einstein.

lol! Seriously, you are now going to spew a lie that has been quote mined, distorted and drawn out of context.

Einstein in FACT said that the lie that he believed in a personal was being repeated and THAT was what made him angry.

You can continue to pull the same line that half the US uses, mine, distort, and reuse until it becomes the truth.

Hmm, sounds a lot like the editing process of the bible. By the way.... What version do you think is the word of god? The KJ new testament? The catholic original before the protestants butchered it to their own gain? Or the Torah, as the bible's old testament was known before the early catholics (yes, they were the FIRST christians) butchered IT in turn to make their book. OR the Koran, another book written using the exact same tactics, and yet a book you think is a lie.

You do not come of as witty, or smart. You come off as stupid, small, petty, and as an attentino whore. Now go get interviewed by PBS and post the link for us to watch you or go away troll.

James...Hey, 99% of the people in prison are Christian, Muslims or Jews because 99% of the people in America are Christians, Mulsims or Jews. Ya know? Hello?

The slam at Sarah Palin's kid is just ugly. You having to go there says a lot about you and your intellect.

And if you could read correctly, you'd see that I supervised the interviews for a PBS primetime special that I produced. OK?

I have a Showtime special on Netflix and Blockbuster where I supervised many interviews, too. But I don't need to prove anything to YOU.

I gotta ignore you. It's that lame.

PS James...so because of the old criminal/minister father you are all upset with God. Sorry about that. But now I understand.

I notice the word Troll seems to be big in the atheist community.

Hello James....Johnson does have a good point when you said: 99% of people in prison in the US self-identified as followers of a god.

Because most people in US, in prison or not, call themselves followers of God.

And few years for tax fraud is the same as life or many more years for murder?

Because there are lots of them in the religionist community, OhMy. And they are loud, persistent and usually intellectually dishonest.

James. The remark about Palin's young child was very bad.

gary from philly - and in your crowd we get the one's going after Sarah Palin's kid. Be proud of that! Ugly stuff, from ye who have the answers.

RJ, I can't seem to find where you specified the names of the programs you've produced. It would be of interest to some to check out those programs, if you would be so kind as to identify them.

Well gary, why don't you to Blockbuster and search "It's Black Entertainment" OK?

I'll make it easy for you. Cut and paste: http://www.blockbuster.com/browse/catalog/movieDetails/141144

I'm sure you can handle that, right? :)

I can't wait for the comment that says I made it all up and stole the guy's name just for this little msg. board. LOL

RJ--You're welcome to equate me with trolls when you actually witness me behaving trollishly. Otherwise, each person, regardless of beliefs, should be judged individually.

And gary, here's a review of a show I created and produced, if you need to see this kind of thing. New York Times...is that big enough? Hello?

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9800E4DD1330F93BA15752C1A962958260

gary..I never called you a troll.

quote: "your crowd"

"your crowd" = atheists. Sheesh.

Now look up that stuff. You asked for. I say look at it. LOL

gary

I've been under the same kind of critical scrutiny as Sam Harris and I've played to much bigger crowds.

R.J. Johnson - The New York Times review was pretty cool. I got to admit that.

RJ--Oh, I did. It satisfied my curiosity.

gary. Cool.

--RJ--

I am embarrassed for you on so many levels.

Todd

Todd - Gee, how many levels would that be? LOL

Todd. PS gary from philly asked. I answered.

Oh My god,

I would pay good money to see RJ interview Sam. He would completely wipe the floor with you.

I've only read about half the comments but I assume RJ still hasn't offered examples of the questions he would have asked.

You seem to want a debate instead of an interview. The interviewer did a very good job of getting across Sam's views while keeping her own objective. I'm pretty sure this was the intention of the interview. Why do you assume that there have to be arguments in an interview? That is called debate which was not the purpose here.

P.S. You have taken Sam's side by saying you would like to "...see how long Sam Harris would last publicly talking about Allah in the Middle East."
This just proves one of the main issues with religion, the fact that it is still treated as such a taboo subject and you can still be killed, in some parts of the world, for criticising it.

To quote Douglas Adams "I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting. But it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously."

Alan

Alan,

And of course everyone quotes Douglas Adams all the time! I love his beer, too!

Alan,

"I love when you speak French." - Gomez Addams

Why do people say they would pay "good" money to do something...as opposed to "bad" money.

The issue is not "arguments" as part of an interview. The issue is basically saying nothing in what was essentially a non-interview.

But as I said. I really don't care about Sam Harris. My beef is with Pat.

Alan,

PS Sam Harris said that he was raised by a Jewish mother and a Quaker father, and he told Newsweek that as a child, he "declined to be bar mitzvahed." But Harris told Bill Maher that he grew up in a secular home and his parents never discussed God.

RJ, I see you still offer no examples of the questions you think Patt should have been asking. You cannot just slag off somebody's interview technique without explaining how it could have been done better. You are just coming across as a sad, angry, petty troll.

Alan,

Can you imagine Morley Safer or Mike Wallace interviewing Sam Harris when Harris said that a certain scripture was "a jewel in a dung heap." You think, maybe, they would have at least stopped for a moment and dealt with a possible inflammatory comment like that? No? You can't see that? Or can you?

No offense, but If you can't, it goes to your probable lack of experience in these matters.

PS I think you need a new word besides troll. I know it is big with this crowd but it's getting a little stale, don't you think?

And Alan,

You think Patt might have dealt with this:

Sam Harris said that he was raised by a Jewish mother and a Quaker father, and he told Newsweek that as a child, he "declined to be bar mitzvahed." But Harris told Bill Maher that he grew up in a secular home and his parents never discussed God.

I think this is the other side of religious fundamentalism. The fact is that no one knows if there is a god and there is nothing moral or immoral if you believe or not. This is his schtick just like Fallwell had his. It is the same thing; people making a buck off talking and lecturing to others.

I agree with you lj. A fundamentalist is a fundamentalist, regardless of its outer appearance or rhetoric. Extremism is odious and ignorant and typically at the expense of others. But we can say that extremism is also sensational and makes for great media ratings.

I do, however, resent that Sam Harris attempts to cloth his fundamentalism in the cloak of reason. And I am a little shocked that so many people are taken in by such a simple ploy.

LJ and Roger,

Good to see you here!

lj,
That's the exact point Sam is trying to make. No one knows about existence of god. It's the religious nuts who claims to know it for sure and use it to kill others who don't agree with their god.

And R.J.
Put your pants back up, get out of your mom's basement and find yourself a life.
8000 posting is quite enough and most of them are BS about what you know and what you do. No one is buying it.

Religion is Organized Crime

Infinity Refutes Divinity

There Never was Nothing

Universe is Infinite

A so-called "Creator-God" must have something to "Create"!
But: "There NEVER was NOTHING"!

This means whatever there now is; "EVOLVED" through INFINITY!
"Mass/Energy never disappear, ever were ever here"!

Therefore no need to create something! Right?

A so-called "Creator-"God" is a fairytale character,
used by thieving Charlatans to enslave people like 'You'! If you are a 'Religionist'!

A bit of 'GOOGLEING' research would possibly help improve your comprehension of the origin of WORDS, and their meanings, as first uttered by aboriginal humans, and later defined!

The term "God" is derived from Mythology, and actually referred to, and described the most horrible, frightening, fearful, and evil 'Spirits'!
Now, don't you find it strange that the simple minded among us are led to believe they should go down on their knees to a "Ghosty" effigy of the same name, that suddenly symbolizes goodness?
Doesn't this one factor demonstrate the degree of idiocy required of those who 'actually' believe in an "Intelligent Designer", "Creator God"?
Or, a "Supernatural Ghostly Apparition"?

Literate articulate rational people 'know' that such phrases or words presuming to describe how the world we live in came about; such as:
"First Cause", "beginning", "Creation" etc. are veritable 'oxymorons' that either' contradict
each other, or fail to produce any reason for believing such asinine presumptions are true!
In order for something to have a "beginning" it would need to have NEVER BEEN in existance!
If something is callled a "First Cause", isn't this phrase ignoring the "Cause" of the so-called "First Cause"?
And, isn't it 'presuming' there once was NOTHING!
Doesn't "NOTHING" 'mean' there wasn't 'ANYTHING' AT ALL' that could "Cause" even a "First Cause"?
Cause implies 'impetus', but when there is "NOTHING" there isn't even an impetus,
"NOTHING" means absolutely NO THING, NOT EVEN ZERO!
Once these indisputable facts are fully understood, one must realize that anyone claiming knowledge of a so-called "Creator-God" or a "Supreme-Intelligent Designer" is a scoundrel, a LIAR, and, most likely a thief!
'ALL' "Religions" based on these lies, are ORGANIZED CRIMINAL SCHEMES used to warp the minds
of innocent children and naive fools, deprive them of their pristine mental acuity, brainwash, indoctrinate, brand, and program them to be toady robotic slaves and abetting proselytizers, who will help to promote and spread this evil 'mental sickness' to 'present', and 'future' generations of humanity!
These "RELIGION ORGANIZED CRIMINAL SCHEMES" have been perpetuated for centuries, and passed on generation to generation of ignorant people by the indoctrination of innocent children when they were totally defenseless and believed in a fairytale "Santa Claus" and the "Tooth FAiry"!

THESE CRIMINALS MUST BE STOPPED!

R.J. Johnson is an embarasssment to the RATIONAL people of California.

And to RATIONAL people everywhere!

His RESEARCH DEPARTMENT IS AWOL!

leos - I resent that! I live in my dad's attic, OK? I remember you when we waited in line for weeks to see the last "Star Wars" movie. Loved your costume! But if your best dig is "get a life," you're communication skills are a bit pathetic.

Jim H. - You think people are going to read that novel you just posted.

Jim--a bit on the strident side, but truth be told--you're not wrong. As far as you go.

Jim H.

Both California and everywhere? They are two separate places? Why the need to repeat. LOL Thanks for the laugh, Jimbo.

gary, I thought you'd be busy renting "It's Black Entertainment."

Now will someone respond to this please:

Sam Harris said that he was raised by a Jewish mother and a Quaker father, and he told Newsweek that as a child, he "declined to be bar mitzvahed." But Harris told Bill Maher that he grew up in a secular home and his parents never discussed God.

We are heading toward 400 comments.

Jim H. How is your blood pressure? Taking meds for that?

gary...how do you know Jim is correct? You are just guessing. You don't really know. But you state it as fact. Come on, that is so silly.

Jim H. I just hope you are not flying any planes near any IRS buildings. You sound rather unhinged right now. Must you bellow?

R.J.
Can you point me to an article where Sam claims to have declined to be bar mitzvahed.
I'd be really disappointed if he really said that because I know he told Bill Maher that he was raised in secular home.

Not sure I share Sam's gushing views on 'The One'.

Leos, did you read what I wrote? Evidently, Harris told that to the magazine, Newsweek. Newsweek.

Leos, Harris seems to be very secretive about his childhood and parents. So secretive, it makes me go, hmmmmmmmmm.

"Our moral apparatus makes us discard killing someone for eating shrimp -as Levithicus proclaims or from slavery- and focus on morally acceptable behavior"- Now that sentence just proved to me how we are evolving into more ethical beings and religion adjusts and evolves with our cultural leanings. EVERYTHING EVOLVES FOLKS, religion included. Bravo for SH

R.J.
I understand that it was on the
"Newsweek" but usually you can find the actual article on line. I tried googling the article but the only thing i found was a website which claims that there is such an article. I also found a Newsweek article on Harris debate with Warren and few others but none of these articles mention his upbringing. I just have hard time believing someone like Sam would make this kind of mistake but if he did, I'd sure like to see it and I would certainly have different opinion on Sam.

Religion is the refuge of the ignorant. "God" is as real as Sant Claus it is a delution. To rationalize that an invisible being exist is absurd and to further amplify this absurdity by asserting that the invisible being is all mighty and powerful is luticrus. The origins of religion are rooted in cults and ritualistic practices done by savages in earlier times.

Leos,

I think you should contact Sam Harris by e-mail and ask him about the web site that talks about his childhood and ask him why he doesn't have it changed if it is incorrect. And maybe you could also ask him why he seems to be so secretive about religion and parents and his childhood.

...things a good interviewer would ask him. ..not as part of an argument but as part of a good interview.

Case closed.

PS Leos, at least you are communicating more rationally than that rant about me living in my parents basement, etc. If you want to know the truth about some of the things I do, please rent "It's Black Entertainment" from Blockbuster Online. Netflix, too I believe. This is not bragging. Just stating a fact in my non-basement living existence. Thanks you.

Open Mind--There's no guessing involved. Even a cursory reading of the history of organized religion will reveal what an evil invention it is; and any sort of examination of religious belief reveals its innate irrationality and increasing anti-intellectualism.

Sam's use of the phrase "dung heap" is a perfect metaphor for the process religionists use to select scriptures that satisfy their existing moral status and narcissistic intentions. What is tossed aside we call waste and that is an alternative definition of dung. Also, "dung" is more evocative of the actual process by which the scriptures of all religions are created - that being the ingestion of ideologies that support and sustain humankind and elimination of the residual elements that are toxic to it.

Well-thought and well-spoken!

Sam Harris is brilliant. Being moral for the sake of caring for each other is core belief amongst atheists. It is nothing like the childish false morality of the Bible which dictates morality through fear of punishment for eternity.

Thanks for this.

gary from philly, No offense but then how did someone like me manage to accomplish what I've done when I am part of a system that you describe as: "innate irrationality and increasing anti-intellectualism."

Hmmmm....

Franklin,

But your holidays are really bad.

R.J.
Living in mom's basement isn't the worst thing in the world. Hell, it may even be the prudent thing to do these days.
As for Sam, I really do hope the articles are either untrue or taken out of context because wanting to keep his upbringing secrete is one thing but outright lie is completely another.

RJ--What have you accomplished where either rationality or intellectualism are required components? Helped put together a celebrity entertainment special? Puhleeze.

gary from philly,

Gee, I thought I satisfied your curiosity and now this silly slam at me.

"Helped put together a celebrity entertainment special?" I guess you don't know much about producing TV. No offense, but that was really a feeble attempt at trying to put me down. Puhleeze. LOL

And I also sent you the link for the New York Times review of my PBS special on comics who have a disabiltiy. You know better than to say what you said. Cheap but silly shot.

That was pathetic.

gary from philly,

I hate to say this but you leave me no choice...

GOOGLE ME!!!! ROFL

And gary from philly,

These are your words: RJ--You're welcome to equate me with trolls when you actually witness me behaving trollishly.

Well, I think you might be acting like a troll, now. Puhleeze.

Puhleeze

R.J.

PS gary, I can't respond to you any more. Take care!

R.J. Johnson;

As you have pointed out, you have said very very little directly about religion or God. My take, however, is that you are a believer in God; you feel (know) God is real, that He exists. I would very much like to hear your single best, most convincing argument for why you believe in His existence. Of course, I'm certain, R.J., you have many more than just one strong reason, but please, kindly accommodate and let us hear your most powerful reason.

donobi

Great interview. It's great to hear such a clear a rational person speak about religion.

Sam was magnificent throughout the interview with Patt Morrision.

Sam's books: End of Faith and Letter to a Christian Nation are excellent reads.

Anyone who has not read one or the other is missing something valuable to their mental development.

Patt Morrision did a fine job as an interviewer.

R J Johnson? Who is he?

A critiquer from the sidelines?

There is no quality in his critique, anyway, judging from what he has said and the views expressed by readers about him.

Kate says, "I can't respect anyone who denys religion when clearly he has not studied it or understands it at all." Well, I have studied x-tianity and therefore I can't respect anyone that believes in a 6000 year old universe,a talking snake, a global flood, living to be 900 years old, original sin, being "sentenced" to Hell for not believing something that is unbelievable, etc.,etc....

donobi,

My beef is with Patt Morrison. I am not her to debate doctrine with all of you.

Telmi,

I think Patt Morrison did a rather weak job as an interviewer with Harris.

Do you have the professional credentials to proclaim with authority and experience that she is a "magnificent interviewer"? Just asking.

I have played in Morrison's league and on a bigger scale, too. I'm not on the sidelines. And no offense, but I'm not here to prove anything to anyone just because they try to bait or goad me into an argument.

Take care,
R.J.

R.J. Johnson;

One specific instance where Patt failed, as you have said a number of times, is not taking issue with Sam Harris saying that certain scripture was "a jewel in a dung heap." What would your response, as a professional interviewer, have been to this comment? Seriously, elaborate please.

donobi

donobi,

At the very minimum, I would have at least stopped to acknowledge that Harris had made a remark that would obviously be considered extremely inflammatory to many people. And because of that, I would question if he weren't, perhaps, using the phrase more as a rhetorical device than as a tool to express his ideas. I would at least ask the question.

And I would have asked Harris why he is so secretive about his parents, childhood and religion in his home...given (I think) he had a Jewish mother and a Quaker father.

Also, in a dynamic like this (and especially on a tax-supported, public radio station), I would've made sure that the "other side" had a few moments to make a few comments in response.

Sam Harris makes perfect sense. Everyone should read his books.

All those that say Sam will cause "more harm than good", I challenge you to PROVE IT! Superstition has proven to support nothing, throughout all written history, except wars and atrocities (motivated by gains of cheap power). That HAS been proven. Its a fact... no debate. I also recommend "No Gods, No Guilt" by Dr Uhl (former priest) to shed some light on this topic.

RJ--Oh, you did satisfy my curiosity; it doesn't follow that I was particularly impressed by your accomplishments. Nothing in your--ahem--oeuvre shows that you have any greater insight into this issue or this process than average. You're saying, "Look at my accomplishments!" as if to make an argument that you can't possibly be a part of a system that is innately irrational and anti-intellectual. Well, if you're a religionist (that is, someone who believes and participates in organized religion) that's exactly what you are. I'm not arguing that, as such, you're an innately bad person--just irrational.

gary,

I'm only saying here that my producing credits give me insight into the actual process of conducting interviews that the average person does not have. It's like in horse racing when people think they know as much as the trainers and jockeys. People don't. I am not talking about insight into the "issue."

I don't care if you believe it or not, but PBS doesn't give $100,000 production grants to people and ideas that are "anti-intellectual" and "irrational." They don't. If you want to argue that point, don't waste your time with me. Go tell someone else.

Sam is crazy!

I spent yesterday debating at Speaker's Corner, London. It's funny how it's always the religious minded who get aggressive.

As expected, the religious apologists bring nothing of substance to the table (not unforeseen considering religious belief is by definition comprised of smoke and mirrors). How futile and ultimately frustrating it must be to invest so strongly in defending the indefensible (which may be why religious zealots are such seemingly bottomless cauldrons of hatred). Zeus save us all.

I may end up subscribing to Ms. Morrison's podcasts as a result of this interview. There was only one time I thought she was moving the thing along faster than I would have liked, and it was so unmemorable that 10 minutes later I've forgotten precisely what it was.

Otherwise, I'm somewhat impressed by RJ Johnson still clocking in 40% of the comments, a week into it---and, of course, confusing NPR with an interview segment on "The No Spin Zone". Those of us who are gainfully employed salute you, sir!

It's a big russian roulette game without any bullets in the gun. Atheists look in the chamber before pulling the trigger while the theists never bother to look for themselves.

If there are 'atheists' who believe in a higher power, does that not mean that they are agnostic, then??? Or at least religious, if they believe in a higher power...?
I am a Christian, because I believe there is a 'super human controlling power', i.e. God, but I definitely have doubts about certain things written in the Bible...This book has been translated into English, after how many other translations...I am sorry to say this but some of what Richard Dawkins' super arrogant self writes about, actually make sense.
I also want to point out the fact that authors like Richard Dawkins, Christoper Hitchens and you Sam Harris go about trying to change belief in the wrong way. Some important person said that there is no logic in religion, i.e. books like the Bible are written including metaphors. It is the individuals who believe in the Bible literally that have a problem. They are the ignorant ones who don't understand this, (I think I'm right). If you were to explain this to Christians/Muslims, etc, perhaps they would start to take a different approach to understanding the Bible/Koran.
I'm not purporting to be a priest/imam/religious pundit, but looking at things in a 'jo bloggs' sort of way, is that not the solution? i.e. trying to get people to understand the the Bible is written in metaphors that Jesus used, and literal translation and practical implementation of it is actually quite otiose, anachronistic and rather ignorant.

OK - I read all the way down here -

One Quick Question - How is the Mythology of a Prophet any different than that of Miss Cleo, or a Radio Show Psychic, or even a Psychic Pet Reader? Seriously folks - If the guy sitting next you you said 'I'm a Psychic and I can read the future." - would you move a little closer or start looking for another seat? Is that any different than any of the Religious Prophets that were all Illiterate, Untrained, Malnourished, Disease ridden, and unaware of most of anything existing on the planet in terms of other countries, cultures, and mostly easily found to be sociopathic from their rantings of hate, hell, and intolerance. You are only showing your mind to be completely under control of very simple propaganda to defend these maggot minded, starved, fanatics that foment these Mythological Dead Street Corner Psychics from pre-history.

James Caoe,

Yeah, like I am out of work. Yet another false statement from the crew here.

Re: My posts. Guess, as usual, you just want to hear from the point of view that makes you feel secure.

I think Sam Harris agreed to do O'Riley's show. How bad can it be?

Cool. :)

PS James Cape I truly resent your remark about 40%. 50% was my goal!

PSS James Cape. Of course I would have a lot of posts here. There is basically one of me and many more of YOU. Does the logic of that dynamic register in your mind?

Re: Historians - Josephus, Tacitus, et al.

- Historic Fact: There was a man named Jesus of Nazareth in Israel about 2,000 years ago.

- Historic Fact: Jesus was crucified by the Romans

- Historic Fact: Jesus had a small group of disciples.

- Historic Fact: None of the disciples ever denied the resurrection account and all but one died a horrible, torturous, painful death and still didn’t deny the resurrection story. If they had, the Romans and especially the Jewish leaders would have made sure every one knew about it. And don’t give me some “group hysteria - peer group pressure” explanation, either. The disciples basically went off in many different directions after the death of Jesus and most had little or no contact with each other.

To say this is all made up and fiction is to be uninformed about history. In short, it’s the easy and uneducated way out.

WOW! That interview was an amazing, succinct, little display of reasoning, and I applaud Sam for what it's worth. I also spent the last 10/15 minutes scanning these comments only to be further amazed. WOW again. I'm not that net-literate, but I am familiar with the term "troll" and I do believe you've gorged this one. My apologies if I'm treading familiar ground here, but there's no way in hell I'm reading all those comments. You people are entirely too prolific. haha.
Cheers,
-Old Rasputin